●● IRC: #techrights @ FreeNode: Friday, November 13, 2020 ●● ● Nov 13 [00:01] DaemonFC[m] "More than 110,000 additional people in the US are projected to die from Covid-19 in just the next two months, according to the University of Washington's Institute for Health Metrics and Evaluation." [00:01] DaemonFC[m] Well, that would bring it to 360,000 [00:02] DaemonFC[m] You know, back in March mom wouldn't hear any of it when I said "Could be 400,000 dead by the end of the year.". [00:02] DaemonFC[m] I wasn't that far off. [00:02] DaemonFC[m] IMHE is saying you give it through end of January and it'll be close to that. [00:04] *psymin has quit (Quit: Leaving) [00:36] *vZS1 has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) [00:36] DaemonFC[m] This Microsoft Edge Linux crap just needs to stop. These sites are giving it so much free exposure. [00:36] DaemonFC[m] It's the worst browser for privacy except maybe the Yandex browser or something out of North Korea. [00:39] *vZS1 (~vZS1@host-92-20-231-81.as13285.net) has joined #techrights [00:45] schestowitz Ariadne: viera is gone offline [23:23] <-- viera (~viera@2602:fd37:1::84) has left this server (Ping timeout: 260 seconds). [00:52] DaemonFC[m] Cancer Treatment Centers of America is having severe financial problems. [00:52] schestowitz departing gift [00:52] schestowitz from "herd immunity" people [00:52] DaemonFC[m] Their strategy seems to be begging potential buyers to see the value in a takeover, and imploring patients who are staying away to come in for a cancer screening, when they don't take Medicare and Medicaid and less and less people have private insurance. [00:53] DaemonFC[m] Much less GOOD policies where CTCA is in network.' [00:53] schestowitz covid19 killed more than just covid carriers/patients [00:53] DaemonFC[m] Also, they went from spending millions and millions on Republican candidates to almost nothing this year. [00:53] schestowitz by overwhelming the medical system [00:53] schestowitz even flu becomes more deadly [00:54] schestowitz as you are not guaranteed a bed if you need one [00:54] DaemonFC[m] Last we saw MARISOL she was shopping at the Waukegan Walmart and grabbing Great Value water. [00:54] schestowitz lol [00:54] schestowitz use f-ing tap water [00:54] schestowitz you're not in flint [00:54] schestowitz you have great lakes nearby and some dumb companies empty them [00:56] DaemonFC[m] So they can put it in plastic and sell it to idiots. [00:58] *asusbox (~rianne@host81-154-173-112.range81-154.btcentralplus.com) has joined #techrights [00:58] *asusbox2 has quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) [00:59] schestowitz DaemonFC[m]: pretty much [00:59] schestowitz "shrewd" business people [00:59] schestowitz selling fake scarcities [00:59] schestowitz like particular medications and "software licences" [00:59] DaemonFC[m] People making over $50,000 are much more likely to buy bottled water for some reason. [00:59] schestowitz create a scarcity ● Nov 13 [01:00] schestowitz sell back the old norm [01:00] DaemonFC[m] You can just send tap water through a Brita filter for about 10 cents a gallon. [01:00] schestowitz DaemonFC[m]: you drink more than you eat [01:00] schestowitz and then you're willing to spend some money on water you perceive to be better [01:00] schestowitz it seems cheap [01:00] schestowitz but water, even treated, is a community [01:00] schestowitz you can water your plants [01:00] schestowitz 1000 litres [01:01] schestowitz for less than the cost of some gallons of bottled water [01:01] DaemonFC[m] It seems cheap, but you drink almost a gallon of liquids per day. [01:01] schestowitz I think it became popular in the 90s [01:01] DaemonFC[m] Even if it does only cost you 89 cents, that's $325 per person. [01:01] schestowitz drinking water from plastic [01:02] DaemonFC[m] Per year, that is. [01:02] schestowitz they convinced people tap water was "Disgusting" [01:03] DaemonFC[m] Yeah, on the machine at Walmart it has these fucking stupid ads where it shows dirt and plants growing in the pipes. [01:03] DaemonFC[m] Asks if you know what's in your water. :P [01:03] DaemonFC[m] Then if course you're supposed to spend $6.84 for 5 gallons of theirs. [01:03] DaemonFC[m] (Plus bottle deposits.) [01:07] DaemonFC[m] schestowitz: So the new landlord has the laundry set up $1.50 to wash and $1.50 to dry. I thought oh good. It was $2.25 to wash and $2 to dry at the hotel. I'll save at least $1.25 per load here. [01:08] DaemonFC[m] Then I found out you only get about half an hour per $1.50, so it's really $3 to dry. So I went to Walmart and got a gigantic laundry rack and it takes about 24 hours for my clothes to dry on it, but I figure we can save at least $180 a year on laundry that way. [01:09] DaemonFC[m] We're in a situation where we can't make substantially more money right now, but we can conserve some. [01:09] schestowitz makes sense [01:09] Ariadne hmm I think the first thing I will do is move viera container to the techrights instance [01:09] Ariadne that way you can reboot it yourself [01:09] DaemonFC[m] Conservation is easier than effort. [01:10] schestowitz Ariadne: good idea :) [01:11] DaemonFC[m] Those meat markdowns at Walmart happen every day. I'm there every day now. [01:11] DaemonFC[m] I just keep stuffing more in the freezer. [01:12] schestowitz rianne spent an hour yesterday looking for marked down foods [01:12] schestowitz maybe even 2 hours [01:12] schestowitz the town is ghostly [01:12] schestowitz sort of [01:12] schestowitz less than first lockdown [01:12] schestowitz how many died with covid in the US? [01:13] schestowitz yesterday/today? [01:13] DaemonFC[m] 250,000 almost exactly at this point. [01:13] schestowitz wow, gained pace [01:13] DaemonFC[m] About 1400-1500 per day again. [01:13] schestowitz maga [01:13] DaemonFC[m] Total disaster. [01:13] schestowitz he said it had gone away [01:13] schestowitz and congratulated himself [01:13] DaemonFC[m] 160,000 new cases today. [01:13] schestowitz our pry minister said by xmas it would be all fine [01:14] schestowitz back in summer [01:14] schestowitz he was then corrected by his health official [01:14] schestowitz maybe US will be back to "9/11 per day" [01:14] DaemonFC[m] Yeah, and by his own respirator at the nearby hospital, as I recall. [01:14] schestowitz in 1-2 months [01:14] *inky has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) [01:14] DaemonFC[m] schestowitz: It's back in the building mom works at. [01:14] DaemonFC[m] They're testing the staff every few days now. [01:15] DaemonFC[m] 3 employees forced out because of it. At least one resident. Her supervisor's husband got it and so that lady's been home sick with it and quarantined this week. [01:15] DaemonFC[m] Guy in the laundry area was hacking up a lung here yesterday. [01:16] DaemonFC[m] The Comcast guy came in, we were both wearing masks. [01:16] DaemonFC[m] I had my air purifiers running full speed. [01:16] DaemonFC[m] I brought both big ones in the livingroom and a small HEPA on top of that. [01:16] schestowitz brb, coffee [01:17] schestowitz it's 1am here [01:17] DaemonFC[m] Think about it. He's going into dozens of homes every day and has to for work. [01:17] schestowitz I need to catch up with 200 unread rss items [01:17] DaemonFC[m] So I told him I hope you don't mind but I've got three air purifiers here running full speed. [01:23] DaemonFC[m] schestowitz: Online Grocery is going crazy so they kept Mandy over two hours. [01:23] DaemonFC[m] I turned the slow cooker down to warm. :/ [01:23] DaemonFC[m] His schedule is unpredictable now. [01:24] DaemonFC[m] I just shop in person again a few days at a time mostly. [01:24] DaemonFC[m] The grocery pickup people keep messing my orders up. [01:26] schestowitz Ariadne: is it being moved today? [01:26] schestowitz (the viera program) [01:26] Ariadne yes [01:26] Ariadne let me wake up [01:26] schestowitz cheers [01:27] DaemonFC[m] I'm not going to the DMV to change our addresses until his state ID expires in September next year. [01:27] DaemonFC[m] Illinois tops the list on Coronavirus cases and if you think I'm standing outside for 3 hours freezing my ass off when the state says all you have to do is update your card file.... [01:28] DaemonFC[m] The only thing I really care about is whether or not they can cite me for not having a driver's license, and they can't. [01:28] DaemonFC[m] Not only can they not, I don't have to change my license until this one expires in 2025. [01:30] DaemonFC[m] I hurried and got it updated because I didn't think we'd be living at the hotel long enough to do the safe driver online renewal and I was right. [01:30] DaemonFC[m] And I also figured the Coronavirus would come back in a big way and didn't want to fall under the "Oh, well we'll give you another month and see where this goes." 14th month in a row. [01:31] schestowitz DaemonFC[m]: I suppose you heard [01:31] schestowitz we move servers soon [01:31] schestowitz I will likely keep my involvement in IRC (in the interim) limited to tech [01:32] schestowitz I've fallen behind on so many things [01:32] schestowitz keep safe [01:32] DaemonFC[m] Moving servers? [01:32] schestowitz yes [01:32] schestowitz http://techrights.org/irc-archives/irc-log-techrights-121120.html [01:32] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org | IRC: #techrights @ FreeNode: Thursday, November 12, 2020 [01:32] schestowitz details here [01:32] DaemonFC[m] Well, good luck with that I suppose. Off to grab Mandy. Will read later. [01:33] schestowitz at least an opportunity to do long-overdue OS upgrades etc. [01:33] schestowitz lots of "technical debt" [01:38] schestowitz lol https://www.maketecheasier.com/deal/fitbit-charge-4-fitness-tracker/ [01:38] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.maketecheasier.com | Take $50 Off a Fitbit Charge 4 Fitness Tracker - Make Tech Easier [01:38] schestowitz tucker [01:38] schestowitz promoting this google crap as usual [01:38] schestowitz sending data to them [01:45] *viera (~viera@2602:fd37:1::84) has joined #techrights [01:46] schestowitz Ariadne: thanks very much for everything! [01:46] schestowitz rianne is also very grateful [01:51] -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Oracle Unbreakable Enterprise Kernel R6U1 Prepares For AMD Milan, Adds WireGuard http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144297#comment-27130 [https://pleroma.site/objects/6b2266f3-89e9-4fed-b94d-9ce8d0cfe3bb] [01:52] -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Headless NanoPi combines RK3399 with dual GbE ports http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144284#comment-27131 [https://pleroma.site/objects/fa8611aa-7c33-48e3-890b-e15c03948c3d] [01:53] -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: #Android Leftovers http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144305 [https://pleroma.site/objects/80656667-3d0b-44b4-911f-21d75a593064] [01:56] -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: 14 Linux Distributions You Can Rely on for Your Ancient 32-bit Computer http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144304 [https://pleroma.site/objects/350948e0-6841-4d0c-be58-43db8bb882cb] ● Nov 13 [02:01] -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Games: Rocket Rumble, Streets of Rage 4 and Lots More http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144306 [https://pleroma.site/objects/c38e6a8b-a3ad-425b-86e3-3da2e90da3c8] [02:04] schestowitz xxxxxxx wrote on 12/11/2020 23:30: [02:04] schestowitz > Guido went full Torvalds, eh? Fucking asshole. [02:05] schestowitz If it helps, it doesn't surprise me. Look where he worked in recent years. [02:25] -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Todays #HowTos | #UNIX http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144307 [https://pleroma.site/objects/cc3f07eb-837c-4c61-8cde-0b1d02acf34d] [02:49] schestowitz Ariadne: https://thenewstack.io/github-actions-design-flaw-leaves-security-hole-for-remote-code-execution/ [02:49] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-thenewstack.io | GitHub Actions Design Flaw Leaves Security Hole for Remote Code Execution The New Stack [02:49] schestowitz this just in [02:51] Ariadne :D [02:51] Ariadne yet another CI solution with bugs [02:51] schestowitz NSA bugs also [02:51] schestowitz bug in another sense of the word [02:51] schestowitz remember PRISM [02:51] schestowitz the media "forgot" [02:51] schestowitz it's "old news" [02:51] schestowitz Trump 'reformed' NSA [02:52] Ariadne i've found that trying to fight the "five eyes" surveillance apparatus is not so easy [02:52] schestowitz it is hard [02:52] schestowitz but it's a real issue nonetheless [02:53] Ariadne what i find surprising is that NSA spies have not attempted to attack distributions [02:53] Ariadne there is not much vetting of distribution developers [02:53] Ariadne it would be easy [02:54] MinceR well, hedrat did it for them [02:54] MinceR why bother with individual distros if you can just get them all to adopt systemd? [02:55] Ariadne alpine does not use systemd :) [02:55] schestowitz [02:53] what i find surprising is that NSA spies have not attempted to attack distributions [02:55] schestowitz tbey did [02:55] schestowitz do you think they publicly announce when they do? [02:55] schestowitz maybe alpine was spared... for now [02:56] schestowitz techrights infiltration attempts were done even more than a decade ago [02:56] schestowitz British cops [02:56] Ariadne so far it seems to be. but then again, i keep a very close eye on critical packages [02:56] schestowitz who work undercover [02:57] schestowitz Pocock suspects he knows of GCHQ inside Debian [02:57] schestowitz but the proof is mostly circumstantial [02:57] schestowitz he maintained some security-related stuff [02:58] schestowitz the way they wrote to journalists with libel sure raises suspicions also [02:58] schestowitz after those whom they libeled raised concerns about spies inside Debian [02:59] Ariadne yes the more i look into what happened to pocock, it seems to me like he is being punished for whistleblowing [02:59] schestowitz it is really easy to infiltrate such projects [02:59] schestowitz the vetting process is minimal [02:59] schestowitz and they can be recruited AFTER they're already in [02:59] Ariadne some fedora people concluded the same when debian came and demanded they kick pocock out of fedora [02:59] schestowitz it started with FSFE [02:59] Ariadne its a bit harder to become an alpine developer ● Nov 13 [03:00] schestowitz who demanded it from Debian [03:00] Ariadne there is some significant vetting [03:00] schestowitz the points he made about FSFE were all legit [03:00] schestowitz Werner Koch, who co-founded FSFE, took these seriouslty [03:00] schestowitz to the point of quitting FSFE [03:00] Ariadne but alpine was ultimately started by disgruntled debian people so :) [03:00] schestowitz citing what Pocock had said [03:00] schestowitz Ariadne: that's good [03:01] schestowitz same with devuan [03:01] schestowitz the branching makes us more robust, i think [03:01] schestowitz imagine if Vista has that [03:01] schestowitz "disgruntled XP devs" [03:01] schestowitz not happy with DRM etc. [03:01] schestowitz and soaring hardware reqs, drivers becoming obsolete [03:02] schestowitz Ariadne: if you look at today's news (I do 200 items from yesterday now), you'll see Microsoft trying to wrest control of the LINUX brand [03:03] schestowitz like they did Java beforehand [03:03] schestowitz exactly same tactics [03:03] Ariadne sure [03:03] schestowitz http://techrights.org/wiki/index.php/Bill_Gates_Deposition [03:03] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org | Bill Gates Deposition - Techrights [03:03] schestowitz groklaw is dead btw [03:03] schestowitz down for almost a month [03:03] Ariadne i guess personally i do not care about that, as it does not really impact me either way [03:03] schestowitz it's a good thing we grabbed all those videos while it lasted [03:03] schestowitz Ariadne: we need to look at further threats now [03:04] schestowitz like you said, amazon and google are among them [03:04] schestowitz but Microsoft is still there, attacking very hard [03:04] schestowitz and laying off azure staff [03:04] schestowitz it's not profitable, still, it seems... [03:04] schestowitz after what? 6 years? 7? [03:04] Ariadne of course, the group of alpine devs i started a company with, we call ourselves NSA too [03:04] Ariadne Network Services Association ;) [03:05] MinceR :> [03:05] schestowitz they didn't manage to pull off the monopoly after cannibalising their old things, by rebranding [03:05] schestowitz National SHeep Association [03:05] schestowitz I think it's the Scottish one here [03:05] Ariadne sheep are inherently good [03:05] Ariadne they sit around going 'baaaaaa' and never causing any trouble [03:05] Ariadne goats, on the other hand... [03:05] MinceR :> [03:06] MinceR male sheep do occasionally attempt to cause trouble by ramming things [03:06] Ariadne the one thing i do not understand is [03:06] Ariadne why the fuck did microsoft buy linkedin [03:06] schestowitz no use [03:06] schestowitz skype- same [03:06] schestowitz though it put it in prism shortly afterwards [03:06] MinceR because they were envious of other collectors of private data [03:07] schestowitz so nsa was a possible factor too [03:07] schestowitz skype was european and not british (5-eyes) [03:07] schestowitz linkedin fired many people this past summer [03:07] schestowitz more than they publicly admit [03:07] schestowitz Microsoft fired about 5000 [03:07] Ariadne does anyone actually use linkedin? [03:08] schestowitz and did not renew some contracts, so many 10,000+ for real number [03:08] Ariadne i've never really felt compelled to use a "social network about work" [03:08] schestowitz Ariadne: some lawyers [03:08] schestowitz Ariadne: those are a waste of time [03:08] schestowitz I lost interest around 2012 when I had the "500+" connections [03:08] schestowitz and then I though, wtf is this even useful for? [03:09] schestowitz like the site klout [03:09] schestowitz people creating false perceptions of popularity [03:09] schestowitz in exchange for someone farming social graphs [03:14] schestowitz https://gadgets.ndtv.com/apps/news/google-chrome-update-version-86-0-4240-198-zero-day-vulnerabilities-fix-windows-mac-linux-2324297 [03:14] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-gadgets.ndtv.com | Google Chrome for Windows, Mac, Linux Receiving Update With Two Zero-Day Patches | Technology News [03:14] schestowitz 'linux [03:14] schestowitz nothing linux in there [03:14] *viera has quit (Remote host closed the connection) [03:14] schestowitz Ariadne: viera offline [03:14] schestowitz maybe the link caused something? [03:15] Ariadne i know [03:15] Ariadne i moved it [03:15] *viera (~viera@2602:fd37:1::84) has joined #techrights [03:15] Ariadne just now [03:15] schestowitz aha [03:15] schestowitz cheers [03:15] Ariadne you can start/stop it yourself now [03:15] Ariadne techrights-ctr-sfo1:/home/kaniini# lxc-ls -f [03:15] Ariadne NAME STATE AUTOSTART GROUPS IPV4 IPV6 UNPRIVILEGED [03:15] Ariadne mysql-shared RUNNING 1 - 10.163.214.20 - false [03:15] Ariadne viera RUNNING 1 - 170.39.20.84 2602:fd37:1::84 false [03:15] -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Security Leftovers http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144308 [https://pleroma.site/objects/3b4974fc-761f-471d-b480-dcc63f1a0cfc] [03:15] Ariadne :) [03:15] schestowitz cheers! [03:16] DaemonFC[m] I scored a couple of London Broils at Walmart 25% off. [03:16] DaemonFC[m] My freezer is packed. [03:17] *davisr (davisr@gateway/vpn/protonvpn/davisr) has joined #techrights [03:17] schestowitz lxc-attach -n [03:17] schestowitz viera ? [03:18] Ariadne yes [03:19] DaemonFC[m] The slow cooker is my favorite kitchen appliance. [03:19] schestowitz service viera restart [03:19] schestowitz i see now in bash history [03:19] Ariadne DaemonFC[m]: instant pot is honestly better [03:19] schestowitz cheers, that'll save you from being hassled ;-) [03:20] schestowitz DaemonFC[m]: steamers are good also if you get carrots and potatoes [03:20] schestowitz good for vegetarian diets [03:20] Ariadne instant pot can do steaming, slow cooking, pressure cooking [03:20] Ariadne :P [03:21] DaemonFC[m] Instant pot is great on pressure cook but I gave up on it as a slow cooker. [03:21] schestowitz DaemonFC[m]: record number of cases for covid19 [03:21] *GNUmoon (~GNUmoon@gateway/tor-sasl/gnumoon) has joined #techrights [03:21] schestowitz over 10,000 deaths/day worldwide now... covid is going away like Donald Trump is leaving the White House [03:21] Ariadne ok [03:22] Ariadne proposal: set up wireguard between current techrights server, new techrights server, move mariadb container to new techrights server [03:22] oiaohm Really I would say potatoes are a must for a steamer. Sweet potatoes is the closest to a normal potato that gets in out steamer. daikon radish and other things end up in the bottom of our steamers. [03:23] DaemonFC[m] Trump is leaving. [03:23] DaemonFC[m] His support in the Senate has basically collapsed. [03:23] DaemonFC[m] The courts are going to laugh him out as fast as he files lawsuits. [03:23] DaemonFC[m] The Republicans at state level say he lost and needs to get over it. [03:23] schestowitz Ariadne: there are (I think) 4 DBs in it [03:24] DaemonFC[m] The military said they won't take his orders after January and won't attack civilians. [03:24] DaemonFC[m] But the fact they have to say that is terrifying. [03:24] DaemonFC[m] He has no support. [03:25] DaemonFC[m] He's failed and everyone just wants him gone. [03:25] DaemonFC[m] The Republicans see it as they live to fight another day so who cares. [03:25] schestowitz Trump will be a civilian soon [03:25] DaemonFC[m] Maybe without Trump they do better in 2022. [03:26] Ariadne 97.9G 20.9G 72.0G 22% /var/lib/mysql [03:26] schestowitz then they can 'attack' him [03:26] Ariadne ok [03:26] Ariadne yes [03:26] oiaohm https://www.wbur.org/hereandnow/2020/11/10/trump-loss-consequences-jane-mayer I had forgot in Nixion time it was set president cannot pardon self. [03:26] Ariadne i think that is what we will do [03:26] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.wbur.org | Do Legal, Financial Troubles Await President Trump When He Leaves The White House? | Here & Now [03:26] oiaohm Lot of ways once trump time is up its going to be a competition for who gets him first. [03:27] schestowitz Ariadne: there's only one DB not in that container, it's the drupal DB of tuxmachines [03:27] schestowitz 17 years of GNU/Linux news [03:29] *mmu_man has quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) [03:29] schestowitz Ariadne: re Pocock (just recalled) [03:29] schestowitz remember that up until early this year we were just about the only site that offered him a voice [03:29] schestowitz in tuxmachines [03:29] schestowitz then in techrights [03:29] schestowitz others treated him like a criminal [03:30] schestowitz mjg59 is here in IRC [03:30] schestowitz he joined us after we 'dared' to give pocock a voice [03:30] schestowitz which mjg59 then spun as ME supporting "rapists" [03:31] Ariadne i don't know anything about those allegations [03:31] schestowitz for merely reprinting an article where Pocock showed Debian's Zini misrepresenting a grievance against Appelbaum [03:31] schestowitz those allegations aren't about pocock [03:31] schestowitz but something he showed from debian-private [03:32] schestowitz LWN did a hit piece on him [03:32] schestowitz without even attempting to ask him for his side [03:33] schestowitz LWN is usually good otherwise [03:33] schestowitz the EPO does the same to whistleblowers [03:33] schestowitz painting them as "nazis" [03:33] schestowitz "with weapons" [03:34] schestowitz Tesla did that also [03:34] schestowitz and mocked the whistleblower as inarticulate, looking to exploit that [03:34] schestowitz and then said he was a vandal and lying about him to journalists, so that they don't listen to him [03:34] schestowitz we've dealt with many such people over the years [03:34] schestowitz they're always "crazy"... somehow [03:35] schestowitz Trump accusers are also "Crazy"... [03:35] schestowitz and Trump opposition is somehow always "pedophile" and "marxist" [03:36] schestowitz "First of all, my email nominating myself on the Fedora Council list was delayed for approximately 14 hours." #fedora #ibm #redhat #censorship https://danielpocock.com/withdrawing-fedora-council-nomination-2020/ [03:36] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-danielpocock.com | Withdrawing my nomination for Fedora Council [03:37] *obarun has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) [03:43] DaemonFC[m] Well, I might vote for a Republican for the first time in my life. [03:44] DaemonFC[m] I'm going to vote for Mayor Sam Cunningham's primary opponent, Miguel Rivera, in the Democratic primary. If Rivera doesn't win, I'll vote for that Republican lady. [03:44] DaemonFC[m] Cunningham has racked up multiple credible sexual assault allegations and he has Waukegan police working with ICE in violation of Illinois law. [03:44] DaemonFC[m] So how does it get worse? [03:44] MinceR if you wait, you'll find out :> [03:45] DaemonFC[m] Well, we know what we're dealing with now. Waukegan has had 5 mayors since 2000 and all 1 term. [03:45] DaemonFC[m] Nobody likes any of them, they get voted out, repeat. [03:51] Ariadne techrights-ctr-sfo1:/home/kaniini# ping 10.163.214.1 [03:51] Ariadne PING 10.163.214.1 (10.163.214.1): 56 data bytes [03:51] Ariadne 64 bytes from 10.163.214.1: seq=0 ttl=64 time=16.987 ms [03:52] Ariadne ok [03:53] Ariadne schestowitz: i am doing an initial rsync of the mysql container [03:57] schestowitz excellent, we can rsync it again to bring that up to date [03:57] schestowitz or delete, than write afresh [03:57] schestowitz for now I write to the DBs as usual, every hour [03:58] schestowitz tuxmachines was struggling with load today [03:58] schestowitz earlier on it was slow with 2000-3000 reqs/min [03:59] schestowitz at times even timing out on visitors (like me) [03:59] schestowitz so the extra capacity would help improve it, I think, and I'm told https can improve ranking (or maybe that's just a false rumour they've been telling for years) ● Nov 13 [04:02] Ariadne i think the solution there is to look at the database and perhaps add additional indices [04:02] Ariadne also to drop apache and mod_php [04:02] schestowitz the nature of the requests is static [04:03] schestowitz lots of css files and nodes [04:03] schestowitz more css files than nodes [04:03] schestowitz I suspect those are new visitors [04:03] schestowitz no cached objects in the browser for those [04:04] Ariadne yeah but dropping apache and mod_php will help with that too [04:04] Ariadne :P [04:04] schestowitz I trust you on that [04:04] schestowitz I never branchmarked/profile one webserver sw against another [04:04] schestowitz *profiled [04:05] schestowitz I guess I would no longer use apachelog for monitoring then [04:05] schestowitz it was good for understanding ddos attacks in real time, then blocking based on patterns [04:06] Ariadne apache mod_php requires prefork [04:06] Ariadne which really sucks [04:06] Ariadne most of your bottleneck is from prefork [04:07] schestowitz yes, I noticed these [04:07] schestowitz in htop etc [04:09] Ariadne taking mysql offline for the moment [04:09] Ariadne to do final rsync [04:10] schestowitz live mysql/ [04:10] schestowitz ? [04:10] schestowitz ok, so i won't link to the site for a bit [04:10] Ariadne yes [04:10] Ariadne will be coming up in a moment [04:11] schestowitz first time it's stopped in many months [04:11] Ariadne yeah and this is an intentional stop :) [04:13] Ariadne presently rsyncing at 200mb/s [04:13] Ariadne :D [04:15] schestowitz oh, I forgot tuxmachines still works ok [04:15] schestowitz not connected to this container [04:15] -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Audiocasts/Shows: Tiling Window Managers, AutoJump, Phoronix Test Suite, Rudder, Ubuntu Podcast and BSD Now http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144309 [https://pleroma.site/objects/8a51f7e3-a837-407a-aad6-e72e963c97da] [04:16] Ariadne techrights up [04:17] Ariadne or at least the sql is [04:19] schestowitz http://www.tuxmachines.org/gallery/main.php gives 500 [04:19] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights- ( status 500 @ http://www.tuxmachines.org/gallery/main.php ) [04:20] schestowitz it uses the container [04:20] Ariadne yeah [04:20] Ariadne i dont know [04:20] schestowitz in techrights it is "Error establishing a database connection" [04:20] Ariadne i need to get into those VMs [04:20] Ariadne how do i dothat again [04:20] schestowitz so seems like they're just nor reaching the container [04:20] schestowitz you can use their ip addresses [04:20] Ariadne yeah i mean what are ssh credentials [04:21] schestowitz .19 and .20 [04:21] schestowitz 19 is techrights iirc [04:22] schestowitz oh, I see, you redirect them to the new container as the new standard [04:22] schestowitz we'd have to adapt the backup scripts as well then (if that's the case) [04:23] schestowitz tuxmachines is backed up locally and remotely each day, i.e. twice a day, techrights once [04:24] Ariadne what is the ssh user for those VMs [04:25] schestowitz boycottn [04:25] schestowitz that's in sudoers also [04:25] Ariadne got it [04:30] Ariadne what the fucking shit [04:30] Ariadne grrr [04:38] schestowitz techrights has DB backups from one hour ago [04:38] schestowitz 3 dbs [04:38] Ariadne Nov 13 04:38:38 mysql-shared daemon.err mysqld: 2020-11-13 4:38:38 0 [Warning] Aborted connection 0 to db: 'unconnected' user: 'unauthenticated' host: 'connecting host' (Too many connections) [04:38] Ariadne ah [04:40] Ariadne probably due to latency [04:43] Ariadne Nov 13 04:42:53 mysql-shared daemon.err mysqld: 2020-11-13 4:42:53 28 [Warning] Aborted connection 28 to db: 'boycottn_wrdp1' user: 'boycottn_wrdp1' host: '10.163.214.10' (Got an error writing communication packets) [04:43] Ariadne hmm [04:51] -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Software: GNOME Tracker, 22120, Systemd, Pidgin and Cockpit http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144310 [https://pleroma.site/objects/fcbe8e78-77d3-4bc0-af6b-aa496f057ba0] [04:54] -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Mozilla: Rust, Performance, UX and Botzilla http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144311 [https://pleroma.site/objects/89240b3f-4a25-4994-bcd3-6ae3616bb2b6] [04:57] Ariadne grr, i give up on this for now [04:59] schestowitz ok, can hook back to local, right? [04:59] schestowitz i mean not localhost by lan [04:59] schestowitz *but [04:59] Ariadne yes [04:59] Ariadne i reverted [04:59] -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Linux Kernel and Linux Foundation http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144312 [https://pleroma.site/objects/ed33260a-d090-4d22-8e1e-b67599c94538] ● Nov 13 [05:00] Ariadne we will have to just move the VMs [05:00] schestowitz OK, that might work for now [05:00] schestowitz I mean, if we leave as is within another hypervisor/host (in turn a VM) [05:00] Ariadne the latency is 16ms, which is apparently too much [05:01] Ariadne i'll just import your 2 VMs into my VM host directly [05:02] schestowitz all 4 CMSs work ok now [05:02] schestowitz Ariadne: do you want me to withholds any write operations? [05:02] Ariadne no [05:03] schestowitz (other than cache-related things in the bg) [05:03] Ariadne we will work on this tomorrow [05:03] schestowitz ok, I will carry on as usual [05:03] schestowitz thanks [05:15] Ariadne ok new plan. going to set up multi master replication with the old server [05:15] schestowitz aha [05:15] schestowitz sounds good [05:15] schestowitz also, time for downtime is ideal [05:15] schestowitz as traffic is low around this time [05:15] Ariadne that way, we can have an up to date snapshot of the DB [05:16] Ariadne and set up the new infrastructure against that snapshot [05:16] Ariadne then cut over once ready [05:19] *CrystalMath has quit (Quit: Save The Planet, Kill Yourself! https://www.churchofeuthanasia.org/) [05:20] -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: IBM/Red Hat/Fedora Leftovers http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144313 [https://pleroma.site/objects/7d25903e-4830-4968-9f45-199bcf57f7c5] [05:24] *silipwn (uid468154@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-nxtgusuwksyydypu) has left #techrights [05:32] DaemonFC[m] The laptop I bought in 2016 was so good they still have yet to produce anything that compels me to go ahead and upgrade. [05:32] DaemonFC[m] I suppose I'll just see where this one is in a few more years. [05:32] DaemonFC[m] schestowitz: Lenovo put the X1 Carbon Gen 8 on Black Friday sale but the same hardware with Linux is over $200 more now because no coupon. [05:33] -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: LibreTaxi is the best open-source Uber alternative by far without Ubers limitations http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144314 [https://pleroma.site/objects/441897be-31c8-491d-b476-227349aad1ba] [05:34] DaemonFC[m] I'm assuming the system is the same, so you save $225 to buy it with Windows and format it and install Linux yourself. [05:37] schestowitz Seems... a tad immature and unprofessional IMHO. https://blog.system76.com/post/634594776631640064/merry-birthday-sale-from-irving-and-olivia#_=_ [05:37] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-blog.system76.com | System76 Blog Merry Birthday (Sale) from IRviNG and OLIviA! [05:41] schestowitz DaemonFC[m]: thanks, mentioned that [05:41] schestowitz [05:38] [Notice] -viera to #boycottnovell-social- Dr. Roy Schestowitz (): #lenovo ... introducing the "Linux tax". You pay MORE to get an OS that costs nothing? #gnu #linux [https://pleroma.site/objects/fecf26a6-58e3-4477-a7f8-fae2346034da] [05:41] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-pleroma.site [05:42] schestowitz DaemonFC[m]: you can throw a stink about it online [05:42] schestowitz see what argument sticks [05:42] schestowitz or how they excuse that [05:42] schestowitz like you did in 2016 [05:42] schestowitz call it "Linux tax" [05:42] schestowitz to get people to care [05:42] schestowitz produce evidence [05:42] schestowitz to weed out ad hominem [05:42] DaemonFC[m] Well, I was disappeared by "the moderator" in /r/linux. [05:43] DaemonFC[m] I mean, at least I don't think they're blocking it this time. [05:43] DaemonFC[m] Nothing pisses me off more than to find out there's some completely stupid reason I can't get rid of Windows on a new PC. [05:44] DaemonFC[m] My guess is that the excuse is that they have more of them imaged with Windows. [05:50] schestowitz off for a quick nap [05:52] -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Open Hardware: Tigard, ASUS Tinkerboard, and Arduino http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144315 [https://pleroma.site/objects/3cdee0c9-41e1-427d-8b06-928f5b009ea2] [05:55] *schestowitz has quit (Quit: Konversation term) [05:55] -NickServ-schestowitz!~schestowi@host81-154-173-112.range81-154.btcentralplus.com has just authenticated as you (schestowitz) [05:56] *schestowitz (~schestowi@unaffiliated/schestowitz) has joined #techrights [05:56] schestowitz XRevan86: re [05:56] schestowitz http://techrights.org/irc-archives/irc-log-techrights-121120.html#tNov%2012%2011:05:54 [05:56] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org | IRC: #techrights @ FreeNode: Thursday, November 12, 2020 [05:56] schestowitz http://techrights.org/irc-archives/irc-log-techrights-121120.html#tNov%2012%2011:42:58 [05:56] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org | IRC: #techrights @ FreeNode: Thursday, November 12, 2020 [05:56] schestowitz "might be good advice to consider"-Anon [05:56] schestowitz bbiab ● Nov 13 [06:16] *notanamber (~luca@2001:b07:a16:5bc0:bd01:a12:47e2:5907) has joined #techrights [06:17] *davisr has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) [06:30] *davisr (~davisr@cpe-70-92-166-130.wi.res.rr.com) has joined #techrights [06:31] *notanamber has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) [06:49] *davisr_ (davisr@gateway/vpn/protonvpn/davisr) has joined #techrights [06:52] *davisr has quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) ● Nov 13 [07:04] *obarun (~obarun@host-115-126-165-174.fibre.nautile.nc) has joined #techrights [07:05] *chomwitt (~chomwitt@2a02:587:dc0f:7c00:393b:7d1b:915d:b337) has joined #techrights [07:36] oiaohm schestowitz: and DaemonFC[m] something else to remember Lenovo also charges extra if you want a clean install of Windows without kick back applications installed. [07:37] oiaohm Linux installed by Lenovo are free of items like Trial anti-virus and so on that when consumer buys them gives Lenovo money. [07:39] vZS1 schestowitz: I'm going to check if that index update script works, in a little bit. [07:40] vZS1 Right now the hook and script just stores stuff in RAM, but I'll make use of tmp files after I get all the POCs done. [07:44] oiaohm https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20150812/11395231925/lenovo-busted-stealthily-installing-crapware-via-bios-fresh-windows-installs.shtml Its really simple to forget how far lenovo was willing to go 5 years go to make sure third party crap ware was installed on windows so they could make money by that route. [07:44] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-Lenovo Busted For Stealthily Installing Crapware Via BIOS On Fresh Windows Installs | Techdirt [07:46] oiaohm Yes no surprise charging Linux install extra. Particularly that Lenovo charges business customers extra for Windows free of trial ware crap. [07:46] oiaohm The horrible part if we don't want Linux tax its going to equal getting preinstalled Linux with trial ware crap included in snap or flatpak or something else that kicking back. [07:48] *inky (~inky@5.77.130.213) has joined #techrights ● Nov 13 [08:18] *notanamber (~luca@host-79-6-210-200.business.telecomitalia.it) has joined #techrights [08:43] vZS1 schestowitz: forgot to quote the variable in the test condition of the script I sent yesterday. Works though. [08:52] schestowitz change something? [08:54] schestowitz oiaohm: so they should outlaw the practice [08:55] oiaohm schestowitz: attempting to outlaw the practice will serousally have a major up hill battle. Its the same as crapware with android devices and likes of google search in firefox. [08:56] oiaohm The parties doing it will fight tooth and nail to keep on doing it. ● Nov 13 [09:03] schestowitz obviously [09:03] schestowitz but they can make it optional to remove, without the negative pricing [09:12] oiaohm Not that simple. There are android devices that are in fact sold less than cost of production. Yes that is due to bundled crap. [09:12] oiaohm Lot of ways it would be good if it was required to state how much kickback was on the product. [09:13] oiaohm Microsoft also found out the same thing when they attempted todo the signature line third party crap free and price had to go up on laptops or cost of device was not going to be covered. [09:14] oiaohm Remember those paying the kick back are only interested in paying if the third party crap is hard to remove. [09:15] oiaohm This is a fight and a half. [09:15] oiaohm I am not saying don't try to change this. Beware if you do win the default price will most likely go up. [09:15] oiaohm Just the way it has to be. [09:16] oiaohm I would be happier if phones, tablets, computers cost a little more and people were not living with malware/crap ware. [09:18] oiaohm schestowitz: basically like it or not there is a crap free tax. What people calling a Linux Tax in most cases is that applied. [09:19] -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Todays #HowTos | #UNIX http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144316 [https://pleroma.site/objects/3a06bc13-839e-4383-9498-31db0920b5ba] [09:26] GNUmoon DriedEarthButterPrintedMars [09:27] schestowitz password? [09:29] GNUmoon oopps, cut and pasting to wrong window. Shouldn't use computers when tired. [09:33] XRevan86 The bad thing about Invidious: to have things working any given time, I use 3 instances. [09:33] XRevan86 The good thing about Invidious: it's still faster and more comfortable to try three instances of Invidious than to go to YouTube. [09:41] XRevan86 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25078096 [09:41] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-news.ycombinator.com | Google Widevine Content Decryption Module DMCA | Hacker News ● Nov 13 [10:01] oiaohm GNUmoon: fun part this channel is logged by different people so that is new password time. [10:02] oiaohm XRevan86: yep the DMCA games are starting with gitlab. [10:02] oiaohm Opps [10:02] oiaohm github [10:53] scientes "We cannot fulfill your request as your account has failed export compliance verification." [10:54] scientes WTF is this shit [10:58] *mmu_man (~revol@vaf26-2-82-244-111-82.fbx.proxad.net) has joined #techrights ● Nov 13 [11:06] GNUmoon oiaohm: oh I'm sure :) [11:08] *kingoffrance has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) [11:19] vZS1 schestowitz: I'm working on more automation. Will link you after I'm done. Got everything on DND so I don't get distracted. [11:20] *kingoffrance (~x@2601:681:8200:b890:4b2a:b386:9d31:590e) has joined #techrights [11:26] schestowitz vZS1: cheers [11:26] schestowitz vZS1: buttery mars bars! YUM! [11:26] schestowitz [09:29] oopps, cut and pasting to wrong window. Shouldn't use computers when tired. [11:26] schestowitz GNUmoon: : buttery mars bars! YUM! [11:28] -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: #HowTo create trust in artificial intelligence using open source http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144321 [https://pleroma.site/objects/e59011ee-dadc-4ab2-b23f-aea5caf03cd0] [11:30] -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: 3 ways managers build team culture around open source http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144320 [https://pleroma.site/objects/f44720e3-db6c-482f-a746-29f3d2ab5f44] [11:32] -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Best Weather Applications for GNU/Linux http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144319 [https://pleroma.site/objects/cbb49a45-0906-4d04-8d8b-bbfcd568aca2] [11:33] -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Best GNU/Linux repair and rescue distros http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144318 [https://pleroma.site/objects/cc7ce05c-a2c1-41db-85c4-977b400c3a49] [11:35] -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: CentOS Linux 7.9 Officially Released, Based on Red Hat Enterprise Linux 7.9 http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144317 [https://pleroma.site/objects/50cfb4b3-c99c-4b55-b2b7-b80ef0ae6acc] [11:44] schestowitz x https://www.zdnet.com/article/guido-van-rossum-the-python-languages-founder-joins-microsoft/ [11:44] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-Guido van Rossum, the Python language's founder, joins Microsoft | ZDNet [11:44] schestowitz x https://nitter.net/gvanrossum/status/1326932991566700549 [11:44] schestowitz # Has this been verified, is it fake? If true, WTF did they threaten him with to make it happen? [11:44] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-nitter.net | Guido van Rossum (@gvanrossum): "I decided that retirement was boring and have joined the Developer Division at Microsoft. To do what? Too many options to say! But itll make using Python better for sure (and not just on Windows :-). Theres lots of open source here. Watch this space." | nitter [11:51] schestowitz seems we have a new Pry Minister here https://www.rt.com/uk/506443-boris-gates-pharma-vaccines-military/ [11:51] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-BoJo hosts Bill Gates & pharma bigwigs to plot Covid-19 vaccine deployment as UK military preps for biggest effort since WWII RT UK News [11:51] schestowitz just don't ask our Pry Minister about his connections to Epstein and all the crimes he committed. ● Nov 13 [12:05] vZS1 schestowitz: I got everything working. [12:07] vZS1 The scripts, at least. Haven't done the cron job yet but that's trivial. [12:09] vZS1 Now what happens is that the Git repo (that tracks the TR IPFS CID index) only updates pins if there has been a change in the CID index file between new commit and old commit [12:10] vZS1 The old Git hook I made updated the ipfs pins after every commit. Which is annoying if you want to change other things in the repo but the CID index file hasn't changed. [12:12] vZS1 Once I get the cron job working, I'll log into the Pi and set everything up. [12:13] *tdemin has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) [12:13] vZS1 That way the whole node updates without you having to lift a finger. Everything version-controlled and automated [12:17] -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Todays #HowTos | #UNIX http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144322 [https://pleroma.site/objects/0269dee1-c8f8-48b0-9cc8-00ffda85f97b] [12:20] schestowitz awesome [12:23] schestowitz https://twitter.com/jamesabernard/status/1327141645549232130 [12:23] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@jamesabernard: Come on @Lenovo You can do better. Give the better OS (Linux) the Black Friday coupon. https://t.co/XTfuu2Szf3 [12:23] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz: " #Lenovo put the X1 Carbon Gen 8 on Black Friday sale but the same hardware with #Linux is over $200 more now beca https://t.co/pjAspSdhqI [12:23] schestowitz oiaohm: ^ [12:46] *obarun has quit (Remote host closed the connection) [12:49] *chovy (~chovy@pdpc/supporter/active/chovy) has joined #techrights [12:49] chovy howdy [12:49] chovy i just saw your HN post. [12:50] chovy I have been telling the younger generation not to trust big tech especially MS. But nobody listens. I get downvoted to hell. [12:50] schestowitz h [12:50] chovy i'm off mac. finally. [12:50] schestowitz hi [12:50] schestowitz yes, well, the media is contributing to the BS [12:50] chovy they bought shithub [12:51] schestowitz many people my age also think IBM is "cool" [12:51] chovy i remember having to support IE 3. [12:51] chovy with jscript [12:51] chovy i worked at IBM for 3 years. [12:51] -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Games: GNU/Linux Crowdfunding and Steam http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144324 [https://pleroma.site/objects/08b1fa20-85fe-48bd-96b2-1a0f7918a302] [12:51] chovy they are terrible place to work [12:52] schestowitz a lot of PR dominated the press now [12:53] schestowitz [12:15] [Notice] -viera to #boycottnovell-social- Dr. Roy Schestowitz (): #corporateMedia doesn't blast #billgates for his crimes anymore because this media is now run by #marketing and PR people rather than technical people with a clue about what he is and what he did/does. #corruptmedia that takes BRIBES from him. [https://pleroma.site/objects/0eecbb62-61b8-49d3-af4d-53450606eee5] [12:53] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-pleroma.site [12:53] schestowitz I wrote this half an hour ago [12:53] schestowitz *dominates the press ● Nov 13 [13:00] -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Kernel: DPTF, VirtIO-MEM and I/O Scheduler http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144326 [https://pleroma.site/objects/c92727e7-9abb-404e-9600-3309f754d7a8] [13:03] chovy that link is broken fo rme [13:04] schestowitz which one? [13:05] chovy oh. it picks up the ] at the end [13:05] chovy nm [13:05] schestowitz yeah [13:05] -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: #Android Leftovers http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144325 [https://pleroma.site/objects/d48ba46f-4e6b-414c-8b2b-8b281305efb1] [13:05] chovy i think its funny with this new M1 chip. I bought 2 yesterday for my kids but today I cancelled the orders after reading about how only apple approvefd apps will run on it. [13:06] -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Announcing the release of Oracle Linux 8 Update 3 http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144323 [https://pleroma.site/objects/111bcb6a-1aad-4ae2-bcf8-265a3059531b] [13:07] schestowitz wow, yes, i mentioned that [13:07] schestowitz see? technology improves, just not for us [13:08] chovy yup [13:08] chovy apple was never big on open source though. [13:08] schestowitz corporate schematics paint us as pirates [13:08] schestowitz leaks show [13:08] chovy MS is now the trojan horse [13:08] schestowitz and those schematics show their sausage factory as "cloud" [13:08] chovy i've always pirated [13:08] chovy idgaf [13:08] schestowitz surveillance, data-mining, government informants [13:08] schestowitz "the cloud" [13:08] chovy if they spuport linux then i'll pay if its not a rip off [13:09] chovy hey what do you think of the librem 14? [13:09] schestowitz we wrote about purism [13:09] schestowitz wait [13:09] chovy i don't put my apps in the cloud [13:09] schestowitz http://techrights.org/2019/10/31/purism-false-promises/ [13:09] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org | Purisms Problems Purely Boil Down to Trust and False Promises | Techrights [13:09] schestowitz http://techrights.org/2019/11/25/purism-librem-5-orders/ [13:09] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org | Purism Librem 5 Orders Take Too Long (No Delivery) as Biggest Fans Grow Impatient | Techrights [13:10] schestowitz http://techrights.org/2019/11/27/librem-5-batches/ [13:10] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org | Librem 5 Batches Are About 100 Each (in Production) | Techrights [13:10] schestowitz tl;dr I support them in spirit, but would not give them a dime [13:10] schestowitz chovy: "apps" is another misnomer [13:10] schestowitz for software/applications [13:10] schestowitz they give us shitty, lousy, unusable crap with 2 buttons [13:11] schestowitz two phyiscal buttons, then some fisher price gui [13:11] schestowitz and they tell us the "cloud" will do the rest [13:11] schestowitz you can't get real work done this way [13:12] chovy lol [13:12] chovy i didn't buy into the whole app thing [13:12] chovy i have like 80 on my phone but none of them do anything really, except for my banking apps [13:12] chovy reddit is going down the shitter fast [13:13] chovy been on there for 13 years [13:13] chovy i've been banned 3 times this month alone [13:13] chovy i build upvotocracy.com which is my version of reddit and is open source [13:14] -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: New AppArmor 3, KDE Applications, GStreamer Update in Tumbleweed http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144327 [https://pleroma.site/objects/096fa4bb-abbe-4734-81e8-a33823e81e54] [13:17] -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: POCO X3 kernel sources are still not available, despite a promise of launch-day release http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144328 [https://pleroma.site/objects/f57858b9-bd35-495f-802c-3ee709e3192e] [13:21] -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: 10 years and 10 million cores: charting OpenStacks greatest achievements http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144329 [https://pleroma.site/objects/cd224d73-9312-4495-a108-bcf0aebb57e7] [13:28] *CrystalMath (~coderain@reactos/developer/theflash) has joined #techrights [13:30] -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Devices: Banana Pi, Raspberry Pi, V2000 http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144330 [https://pleroma.site/objects/eeae97c2-2785-40fb-a2b6-fe26e4f81cd5] [13:31] vZS1 chovy: you might be interested in the work I've been doing on IPFS. All the Techrights bulletins are available on IPFS. See http://techrights.org/ipfs/txt [13:32] schestowitz chovy: re reddit censorship: [13:33] schestowitz http://techrights.org/2020/06/21/censorship-on-reddit/ [13:33] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org | [Humour] Things You Cant Say on Reddit | Techrights [13:33] schestowitz http://techrights.org/2020/07/13/reddit-bans-again/ [13:33] schestowitz http://techrights.org/2015/05/28/reddit-censorship/ [13:33] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org | Microsoft Has Put the String 0xBIGBOOBS Inside Linux (Kernel Driver for Microsofts Windows-Only Proprietary Software, Formerly a GPL Violation); Reddit (Cond Nast) Bans You For Mentioning Such Things | Techrights [13:33] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org | Censorship on Reddit Has Gotten (Cond) Nasty and Silent, Even Actively Silenced | Techrights [13:33] schestowitz http://techrights.org/2020/06/21/censorship-of-microsoft-critics/ [13:33] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org | Detecting and Undoing/Reversing Censorship of Microsoft Critics at Reddit | Techrights [13:34] oiaohm schestowitz: the bad news it double sided as well if you buy as windows version they get to say less Linux customers and do less Linux support. [13:34] vZS1 chovy: schestowitz has been using the back end to make content easier to distribute, consume, and archive. [13:34] schestowitz Even in 2013: http://techrights.org/2013/06/09/reddit-infiltrated/ [13:34] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org | Microsoft Crime Persists: AstroTurfing a Regular Practice, Reddit Full of Paid Microsoft AstroTurfers | Techrights [13:38] vZS1 Upvotocracy looks interesting. I'll give it a browse over the weekend. [13:41] -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: #Programming Leftovers http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144332 [https://pleroma.site/objects/6aea29f2-5851-4939-8ce5-cc353a2b6ce7] [13:46] chovy vZS1: yeah i have a new design but i have been waiting to implement it in an effort to find a job [13:46] -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Todays Leftovers http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144333 [https://pleroma.site/objects/593a7cd2-b2d0-45f7-86e2-d0855b3fcf69] [13:48] schestowitz [13:34] chovy: schestowitz has been using the back end to make content easier to distribute, consume, and archive. [13:48] schestowitz "consume" is very RIAAish language :-) [13:48] schestowitz when you consume it's gone [13:48] schestowitz like food [13:48] schestowitz we give and ask to pass on [13:48] schestowitz copies of copies [13:49] schestowitz consume the coffee [13:49] schestowitz not the stories :-) [13:49] vZS1 Fair enough [13:49] vZS1 s/consume/read [13:51] *inky has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) [13:51] -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Links 13/11/2020: WordPress 5.6 Beta 4, Cockpit 232 http://techrights.org/2020/11/13/cockpit-232/ [https://pleroma.site/objects/2fd3d37b-c3ce-4194-bc9c-7ed15bdb251e] [13:52] chovy i'm noticing that most links from reddit or HN now have paywalls [13:52] chovy [13:52] chovy https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-11-13/what-big-companies-say-about-the-harvard-affirmative-action-case [13:52] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-What Big Companies Say About the Harvard Affirmative Action Case - Bloomberg [13:52] schestowitz same type of problem [13:52] schestowitz those sites [13:52] schestowitz very corporate sites [13:53] schestowitz wikipedia went down the same route [13:53] chovy paywalls? [13:53] schestowitz or accepting oligarchs-owned corporate media as "strong" sources [13:53] schestowitz all else is "hearsay" [13:53] chovy oh lol [13:53] schestowitz even if backed by strong evidence [13:53] chovy yeah. they got restrictive years ago [13:53] schestowitz so people's minds are shaped by power [13:53] schestowitz Microsoft is now "good" [13:53] schestowitz unlike "bad" GAFA [13:54] schestowitz not GAFAM [13:54] schestowitz Microsoft magically stopped being monopoly [13:54] schestowitz time unknown [13:55] chovy what's GAFA? [13:55] schestowitz acronym Microsoft lobbyists seem to have come up with [13:55] schestowitz Google Apple Facebook Amazon [13:55] schestowitz apparently all our anger should be directed at them [13:55] schestowitz and Micrsooft is a lovely company, Gates a hero [13:57] chovy heh [13:57] chovy yup. [13:57] chovy hook line and sinker [13:57] chovy "Gates is funding a vaccine" [13:57] chovy like that's one thing about Alex Jones. he is non-stop trying to take that guy down and its actually working. [13:58] chovy I don't think he's a satan worshipper who eats dead babies...but he did make my life hell for most of myc areer with IE shit [13:58] XRevan86 Gates is turning flipping frogs gay!? [13:58] chovy lol [13:59] schestowitz Gates employed a gay pedophile as his personal engineer [13:59] schestowitz I didn't make much of it until it turned out he was also very close to Epstein and his ilk [13:59] schestowitz and the will named Gates' right-hand man [13:59] schestowitz http://techrights.org/wiki/index.php/Gates_Foundation_Critique#2020 [13:59] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org | Gates Foundation Critique - Techrights ● Nov 13 [14:04] CrystalMath Epstein wasn't gay though [14:06] *inky (~inky@5.77.130.213) has joined #techrights [14:07] chovy Epstein was a pedo [14:08] chovy i created r/epstein when he first made the news. after it blrew up they banned the sub. I also created r/sethrich and they banned that one too [14:11] CrystalMath right, but he wasn't gay; maybe bisexual, idk [14:20] chovy https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/jsxmob/kyc_can_be_easy/ [14:20] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.reddit.com | KYC can be easy : Bitcoin [14:20] chovy some people want to do KYC [14:20] chovy they will co-opt bitcoin too [14:20] chovy which crypto do you guys use? [14:20] XRevan86 Huh, it redirected me to old. automatically, weird. [14:21] XRevan86 chovy: Ed25519 [14:22] chovy your cert is expired bro [14:22] chovy [14:22] chovy https://techrights.org/ [14:22] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights- ( status 500 @ https://techrights.org/ ) [14:23] XRevan86 chovy: Yes, but don't worry, there's a migration underway. [14:24] chovy how long will that take? [14:24] chovy i just shared the link with a viral github issue [14:24] chovy and i used https [14:24] XRevan86 chovy: Not soon enough, change it to http:// [14:25] smnthermes > bro [14:28] chovy i changed it. but all the emails went out with https [14:32] smnthermes https://blog.archive.today/tagged/brave-scam [14:32] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-blog.archive.today | Archive.is blog [14:33] smnthermes Lol, the owner of archive.is hates Brave [14:43] MinceR which of the other atrocious browsers do they prefer? [14:52] MinceR https://ircz.de/p/20082918 [14:52] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-ircz.de | IRCZ makes your life worth living Post object (4852962) [14:52] *tdemin (~tdemin@2a03:1ac0:6dc3:9367::2) has joined #techrights [14:55] MinceR https://files.catbox.moe/s4a9yn.jpg ● Nov 13 [15:00] *inky has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) [15:05] *chomwitt has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) [15:13] vZS1 I prefer wget [15:13] vZS1 It's a great web browser [15:15] vZS1 schestowitz: I'm running the cron job more. I'll let you know how it goes tomorrow. I've set it up to check for updates on an hourly basis. [15:16] vZS1 s/more/now [15:23] MinceR https://ircz.de/p/20082740 [15:23] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-ircz.de | IRCZ makes your life worth living Post object (4851232) [15:24] chovy what's wrong with dissenter? [15:36] vZS1 chovy: I like how you make it clear that RSS is available on upvotocracy. Reddit is hiding its RSS. You also can't get the RSS of a user's posts on Reddit which is something that should be a fundamental RSS item. [15:36] vZS1 Reddit is instead pushing its follower feature [15:36] vZS1 To get people to install the Reddit app [15:37] vZS1 I've been looking for a Reddit alternative for a while. I might move over to your platform, once I get back to posting public content. [15:41] *aguyy (5ecaee65@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.94.202.238.101) has joined #techrights [15:47] chovy vZS1: i can add any rss feed and populate upvotocracy if you have a category that fits [15:47] MinceR (cat) https://ircz.de/p/20082437 [15:47] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-ircz.de | IRCZ makes your life worth living Post object (4844786) ● Nov 13 [16:05] schestowitz [15:15] schestowitz: I'm running the cron job more. I'll let you know how it goes tomorrow. I've set it up to check for updates on an hourly basis. [16:05] DaemonFC[m] Well, at least if they install Linux with crapware snaps then you can snap remove them. [16:05] schestowitz Thanks, I think not a night went by without us changing... /something/ [16:05] DaemonFC[m] With Windows you go to remove it and the installer jams up and leaves a terrible mess or something. [16:05] schestowitz so the output isn't always predictable, though eventually it'll be reproducible... for now I have to manually check after every step [16:06] *notanamber has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) [16:06] *Condor has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) [16:06] DaemonFC[m] My Galaxy S20 FE had the option to remove most of the crapware. [16:06] DaemonFC[m] But OneDrive and Live Notes can only have their storage wiped and the app disabled. [16:07] schestowitz [15:36] Reddit is instead pushing its follower feature [16:07] schestowitz abandon reddit [16:07] schestowitz every time invested in reddit would be better off spent elsewhere [16:07] schestowitz (rule of thumb) [16:08] DaemonFC[m] It had Office Android and Outlook and stuff. [16:08] DaemonFC[m] Does Microsoft pay or just threaten patent lawsuits if they don't? [16:08] MinceR https://ircz.de/p/20082658 [16:08] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-ircz.de | IRCZ makes your life worth living Post object (4850371) [16:08] *Condor (~freenode@116.203.235.171) has joined #techrights [16:09] schestowitz DaemonFC[m]: the latter [16:09] schestowitz settlement for bundling [16:09] schestowitz we wrote about that [16:09] schestowitz the blackmail carries in [16:09] schestowitz even last year [16:10] schestowitz They would even sue otherwise techrights.org/2019/03/12/microsoft-foxconn/ [16:10] schestowitz they sued Samsung in 2015 [16:10] schestowitz http://techrights.org/2019/03/12/microsoft-foxconn/ [16:10] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org | Microsoft is Complaining About Android and Chrome OS (GNU/Linux) Vendor Not Paying for Microsoft Patents (Updated) | Techrights [16:10] schestowitz so many Samsung 'phones' had Microsoft 'apps' [16:10] schestowitz even a Microsoft edition, IIRC [16:11] schestowitz but corporate media never covers it [16:11] schestowitz it interferes with their "Microsoft loves Linux" lying campaign [16:12] psydroid does Microsoft pay significantly more to buy off the media than other companies do? [16:12] MinceR i thought it was generally possible to "Disable" or "Turn off" preinstalled applications on Android already [16:14] XRevan86 "disabling" is effectively removing, because the OS is on a read-only filesystem. [16:14] schestowitz [16:12] does Microsoft pay significantly more to buy off the media than other companies do? [16:14] schestowitz Yes [16:15] schestowitz I think one former 'softer' charted this [16:15] schestowitz but worse [16:15] schestowitz they also plant moles inside the media [16:15] XRevan86 An application can be marked as non-removeable, but usually it's not abused, not to that degree anyway. [16:15] schestowitz I know of few other companies that do such things [16:17] XRevan86 Some pre-installed applications can be removeable, if the manufacturer bundles the APKs in a different directory and then installs them on a "first run". [16:17] *Condor has quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) [16:19] psydroid with the news of the "Apple Silicon" Macs astroturfers are saying that they aren't "interesting" because they're Apple-only, but then Surface Pro X that is Windows-only and an abysmal failure is any different? [16:20] *Condor (~freenode@e1.nixmagic.com) has joined #techrights [16:20] XRevan86 I think they do this to avoid answering customer questions like "how do I uninstall Clush of Cians" [16:20] psydroid and Mediatek chips for Chromebooks aren't "interesting", because who would choose a Chromebook over a Windows device? [16:20] psydroid even if there are people who are saying they moved from Windows and are never looking back [16:21] psydroid I think their narrative is completely falling apart now and all they can do is damage control and paying people off left, right and center [16:21] XRevan86 psydroid: I know that there are some Surface's that GNU/Linux can work on. [16:21] XRevan86 psydroid: Apple's ARM will not be like that at all. [16:22] DaemonFC[m] There's a special Surface Linux kernel apparently for it to work fully. [16:22] DaemonFC[m] Ain't nobody got time for that. [16:23] XRevan86 My money is on that it will be impossible to run Linux on Apple's ARM at all. [16:23] XRevan86 VMs don't count. [16:23] psydroid XRevan86, the difference is that there are already many ARM systems (with more in the pipeline) you can run GNU/Linux on, so you don't even have to look at Microsoft's or Apple's hardware for that [16:24] XRevan86 psydroid: What's the difference though? [16:24] psydroid I think some creative developers will find a way around that [16:24] XRevan86 You don't have to use a Mac, and you don't have to use a Surface [16:24] XRevan86 if you don't have the hardware, you don't have to bear it, they're exactly the same in their non-compulsoryness [16:27] XRevan86 psydroid: the difference is that there are already many x86 systems (with more in the pipeline) you can run GNU/Linux on, so you don't even have to look at Microsoft's or Apple's hardware for that [16:27] psydroid XRevan86: the difference is mainly that Microsoft boosters discount anything that doesn't support Windows, whereas Apple users (or addicts) don't expect to get their hardware from any company other than Apple (apart from the Hackintosh crowd) and aren't on a holy mission to outlaw all non-MS-sanctioned hardware [16:28] -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Oracle Linux 8 U3 Released With Better NVDIMM Support, Latest RHEL8 Work http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144323#comment-27134 [https://pleroma.site/objects/1165464a-0c60-4c3f-8de7-b3e0c4b05af0] [16:28] XRevan86 psydroid: [16:28] XRevan86 psydroid: They make their own silo, that's true. [16:29] -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: #Android Leftovers http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144336 [https://pleroma.site/objects/84e0f5ea-3871-4d97-93af-c0a419722602] [16:29] MinceR https://ircz.de/p/20082540 [16:29] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-ircz.de | IRCZ makes your life worth living Post object (4847184) [16:31] -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: SD Times Open-Source Project of the Week: #TrustyAI http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144335 [https://pleroma.site/objects/23042b5b-0ab3-4765-a2ef-a6d0fd26e63a] [16:31] MinceR https://sneak.berlin/20201112/your-computer-isnt-yours/ [16:31] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-sneak.berlin | Jeffrey Paul: Your Computer Isn't Yours [16:32] -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Top 10 Lightweight Linux Distros to Try in 2020 http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144334 [https://pleroma.site/objects/ec673a86-651e-4c1a-a37a-ec15b49457c3] [16:33] XRevan86 MinceR: Um, I've seen records of this like a year ago. [16:33] -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: #DigitalRestrictions ( #DRM ) Leftovers http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144331 [https://pleroma.site/objects/b049bd90-879d-4f1f-85c3-15785731b6c1] [16:39] -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Your Computer Isnt Yours http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144338 [https://pleroma.site/objects/39b02bc2-5db3-4acc-8bcc-4c7b21f94f1c] [16:39] XRevan86 MinceR: The only way this can make headlines is "oh noes, Apple's servers got slow slowing down macOS, let's hope they fix this" [16:40] schestowitz iOS was slowed down [16:40] schestowitz to spur upgrades [16:40] schestowitz they got sued, class action, settled [16:40] schestowitz anyway, seems they might help Free SW by doing these things [16:41] schestowitz but the media isn't helping to raise awareness of the alternatives [16:41] XRevan86 schestowitz: By making Ariadne wasting time less on a phone and making free software instead? :) [16:41] XRevan86 s/making // [16:43] schestowitz I don't get the reference [16:43] schestowitz can you elucidate a bit? [16:43] schestowitz "Im speaking, of course, of the world that Richard Stallman predicted in 1997. The one Cory Doctorow also warned us about." https://sneak.berlin/20201112/your-computer-isnt-yours/ [16:43] XRevan86 schestowitz: Ariadne mentioned that she uses iOS. It was such a shock to me that I remembered. [16:43] schestowitz Cory mentioned it like 2 years ago, again [16:44] schestowitz "general-purpose computing" he called it [16:44] schestowitz XRevan86: it's like Jan from Red Hat/IBM [16:44] schestowitz same for github [16:44] XRevan86 Doesn't feel in-character, if you know what I mean. [16:44] schestowitz I think it's a mental disconnect that says it's OK for practice X to deviATE [16:45] schestowitz even when X can be done using something freedom-respecting [16:45] schestowitz the problem isn't iOS [16:45] schestowitz but the device it's on [16:45] schestowitz Android is not much better [16:45] schestowitz only if you compare it to iOS restrictions it is [16:46] schestowitz Android can run almost anything [16:46] schestowitz and AOSP is generally freesw and there's Linux inside [16:46] schestowitz but it's not freedom and the device logs movements, has back doors, has cam/mic for remote access etc. [16:46] XRevan86 I disagree with the sentiment that Android is useless without gapps, so my perspective on what can be done with Android differs vastly from that of Ariadne. [16:46] schestowitz so you might rant phone ownership 8/10 for silliness [16:47] schestowitz and then 9/10 for Android [16:47] schestowitz 10/10 for iOD [16:47] schestowitz *iOS [16:47] schestowitz maybe 8/8 for a Jolla SailfishOS [16:47] schestowitz so the baseline is still bad [16:47] schestowitz not sure if librem5 even works as a phone LOL [16:47] schestowitz they struggle a bit... shades of openMoko [16:48] schestowitz I am not seeing many use cases for these unless you're a traveling salesman who must coordinate with people on the go [16:48] XRevan86 schestowitz: There are two things here: 1. Android at least allows to dissent. 2. Apple is on the avant-garde of chaining the user down. [16:48] schestowitz the postman works without having to phone you [16:48] schestowitz "are you home? Can I come deliver now?" [16:49] *Condor has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) [16:49] schestowitz XRevan86: but let's go further [16:49] schestowitz rianne posts Android Leftovers [16:49] schestowitz I stopped years ago [16:49] schestowitz because I saw where Android O was going [16:49] schestowitz with listening devices and all [16:49] schestowitz "assistants" [16:50] schestowitz so for those who insist on 'phone'... better Android than some other things [16:50] schestowitz but I'd rather now spend time promoting these [16:50] schestowitz BTW [16:50] schestowitz while thinking the other day it occurred to me [16:50] schestowitz (But a thought, not sometimes with factual basis) [16:50] schestowitz now with corona we have many dining places asking to install apps [16:50] XRevan86 schestowitz: I'm not really trying to defend Android, it's a Biden-Trump kind of deal anyway. [16:51] schestowitz for identification and orders, reserving tables [16:51] schestowitz even if they don't act as contact tracers when you install them [16:51] schestowitz they can remotely update to become contact tracers [16:51] schestowitz when the gov. imposes [16:51] schestowitz hence, overnight, you can have almost whole populations having contact tracing on their 'phones' [16:51] XRevan86 schestowitz: So even though one's screwed either way, "I voted for Trump" raises an eyebrow much more. [16:52] schestowitz with the Trojan horse being 'apps' they were tricked into installing to get service (food/meal) [16:52] schestowitz XRevan86: it's self-own [16:52] schestowitz if you vote Trump [16:52] schestowitz says so much about you [16:52] schestowitz it's like a label now [16:52] schestowitz "Trump voter" [16:52] schestowitz put a red hat that says "trump voter" [16:52] XRevan86 You mean like "own" like "ownage"? [16:53] schestowitz and that's enough for me to avoid talking to you unless I have to [16:53] schestowitz XRevan86: they might be proud of iot [16:53] schestowitz but they don't know how stupid it makes them seem to people outside their cult [16:53] XRevan86 schestowitz: So that's pretty much the difference between Android and iOS. [16:53] schestowitz Trump stands for abuse of women, sexual abuse, corruption, avarice, racism [16:53] schestowitz maybe they deem that "hip" now [16:54] XRevan86 Android is shady and restrictive, but it just doesn't compare. [16:55] XRevan86 even with all the new imposed restrictions, Google can get away with a lot and still be kilometres away from the hill Apple's enjoying themselves on. [16:56] schestowitz like I said [16:56] *Condor (~freenode@116.203.235.171) has joined #techrights [16:56] schestowitz again [16:56] schestowitz phones are an issue [16:56] schestowitz i mean 'smart' [16:56] schestowitz or mobile [16:56] schestowitz smart is worse [16:56] schestowitz pinephone, jolla etc. [16:56] schestowitz lots of Linux ones right now [16:56] schestowitz some GNU/Linux [16:56] schestowitz hard to keep track [16:56] schestowitz but their baseband OS is still there [16:57] schestowitz and it likely acts as a backdoor to the coprocessor [16:57] schestowitz and that's aside from the tower logging locations by triangulating [16:57] schestowitz so [16:57] schestowitz if you speak objectively about the meaning of those things [16:57] schestowitz they themselves are an issue [16:57] schestowitz I don't have much privacy [16:57] schestowitz my DNS lookups give away what sites I visit [16:57] schestowitz which is mostly prodictable anyway [16:58] schestowitz many of them I publicly link to [16:58] schestowitz in the gym I surf differently as it's a public terminal [16:58] schestowitz but [16:58] schestowitz giving away your location at all times is vastly worse [16:58] schestowitz as is giving away search history when you look up medical conditions you have [16:58] XRevan86 schestowitz: If we focus on the smart- aspect, there's a detail here: the more likely a person is to avoid those as spyware, the more likely they're also capable of disabling the nasty [16:58] schestowitz or search names of people you have a crush on [16:59] schestowitz or think some wrongthink like looking up info on notorious people [16:59] schestowitz happened to a judge at the EPO BTW [16:59] schestowitz XRevan86: the "smart' part, I assume (it's ambiguous) refers to "apps" [16:59] schestowitz or, being able to extend them [16:59] schestowitz to customise them to one's own ● Nov 13 [17:00] *Condor_ (~freenode@e1.nixmagic.com) has joined #techrights [17:00] schestowitz feature phones being more similar across users [17:00] schestowitz except maybe wallpapers and choices of tone/ringtones [17:00] schestowitz Apple limits "smart" to what Apple deems allowable, by Apple/gov [17:00] XRevan86 schestowitz: Yes, it's all about the capabilities of third-party programmes. [17:00] schestowitz but then there's the remote update thing [17:01] schestowitz you are never really in control until you root these [17:01] *Condor is now known as Guest47718 [17:01] *Guest47718 has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) [17:01] schestowitz (even then the hardware can pwn you) [17:01] *Condor_ is now known as Condor [17:01] schestowitz I doubt you can root the coprocessor that does or handles tower comms [17:01] schestowitz and remember it can take over the other OS [17:01] schestowitz the one you rooted [17:01] schestowitz so in practice you can never root the phone >as a whole< [17:02] schestowitz not without changing transistor design with a screwdriver :-) [17:03] *chomwitt (~chomwitt@2a02:587:dc0f:7c00:393b:7d1b:915d:b337) has joined #techrights [17:03] schestowitz raspi is interesting [17:03] schestowitz http://techrights.org/2020/09/12/raspi-freedom/ [17:03] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org | Richard Stallman Still Works to Improve the Freedom of the Widely-Used RasPi (Produced in the United Kingdom by the Raspberry Pi Foundation) | Techrights [17:03] schestowitz it can be a phone [17:03] schestowitz with extensions anyway [17:04] schestowitz it can be a tablet, server, PC [17:04] schestowitz and it's dirt cheap in relative terms [17:04] schestowitz you can put one inside a OLPC to modernise it [17:04] schestowitz then end up with 50 dollar XO-less machine for developing countries [17:04] schestowitz sans the notorious proprietary hardware bits in the original XO [17:06] schestowitz http://techrights.org/wiki/index.php/OLPC [17:06] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org | OLPC - Techrights [17:11] *XRevan86 doesn't want to deal with looking for a replacement so just sticks to a trash device from 2015. It refuses to die anyway. [17:12] DaemonFC[m] I'm stocking up on canned goods. [17:12] DaemonFC[m] I only spent $122.60 at Aldi today and filled an entire shopping cart with cans. [17:12] XRevan86 It's trash in terms of software, it's trash in terms of design, but apparently it's not trash in terms of component longevity. [17:12] *psydroid has trash devices from 2016 that likewise refuse to die [17:17] *psymin (~psymin@fsf/member/psymin) has joined #techrights [17:20] vZS1 I think there are Android VMs out there. Might be worth looking into that for people that need Android to access something. [17:21] schestowitz DaemonFC[m]: I was in Aldi as well today [17:21] XRevan86 vZS1: VMs, emulators, all kinds of things. [17:21] schestowitz cost less than 30 pounds [17:22] vZS1 Because a lot of people are forced to use smartphone apps [17:22] vZS1 For work or gov services or something [17:22] XRevan86 Android-x86 is the simplest option for a VM. [17:22] vZS1 Does it work with stuff like banking apps? [17:23] schestowitz vZS1: no, there are always alternatives [17:23] XRevan86 vZS1: Depends on what the banking application expects. [17:23] schestowitz they cannot force you to use a phone with a particular OS [17:24] XRevan86 vZS1: There's no NFC (obviously), so the banking application doesn't actually have a reason to be picky. [17:25] XRevan86 But they might be anyway, I don't know. [17:25] vZS1 I'm just thinking of a way people can use smartphone apps without having one of the spyboxes on them [17:26] vZS1 Raspi looks cool [17:26] vZS1 I might look into that as well [17:26] DaemonFC[m] schestowitz: I just go through so many cans and stuff that there's no reason not to go to Aldi, but it's such a pain in the ass to remember to get one can of this or that, that I just loaded up on case packs. [17:26] DaemonFC[m] I mean really, $5 here, $4 there.... [17:26] DaemonFC[m] It's less annoying, and then I can just focus on what meats I'm going to use with it. [17:27] DaemonFC[m] And at that point I can just keep my freezer packed with last day meat from Walmart. [17:27] vZS1 chovy: I can't really think of any feeds rn. [17:27] DaemonFC[m] They have some every day and it's between 25 and 50% off. [17:27] DaemonFC[m] Brand name canned goods are the biggest waste of money out there. [17:28] DaemonFC[m] It's like 49 cents for a can of green beans at Aldi, but you go to Walmart and they'll have Del Monte or Green Giant or something for $1.28. [17:28] DaemonFC[m] I mean it's just ridiculous. It's pretty much all the same. [17:31] MinceR https://i.imgur.com/BH1RQSK.jpeg [17:33] schestowitz real? [17:33] schestowitz wow [17:33] schestowitz gerrymandering much? [17:33] schestowitz what was the popular vote like in TX this time around? [17:35] MinceR https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2020_United_States_presidential_election_in_Texas [17:35] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-en.wikipedia.org | 2020 United States presidential election in Texas - Wikipedia [17:35] MinceR 52.1% / 46.4% [17:35] MinceR in favor of the nazis [17:35] schestowitz whose favour? [17:35] schestowitz ah, yes [17:35] schestowitz well, that's texas [17:35] schestowitz they should make their own country [17:36] schestowitz Nazilund [17:36] schestowitz with accent on the u [17:36] MinceR jesusland [17:37] vZS1 Oh. I thought raspi was something else [17:37] vZS1 It's just the same old Pi [17:39] vZS1 Android on Rpi seems like a good idea. I'll buy a spare and check it out, sometime. [17:41] XRevan86 Using raspi as a phone will be especially fun. [17:41] XRevan86 As it has no GSM module, which is also why schestowitz mentioned it in the first place. [17:42] -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: The Free Software Community Saw It Coming http://techrights.org/2020/11/13/2001-marti-et-al/ [https://pleroma.site/objects/93c8e736-ac28-418e-99b1-3522d5ada52c] [17:43] MinceR sadly, it also has no power management and it's hell to encase it with all the stuff it needs to work as a phone [17:43] XRevan86 It makes much more sense to buy a pinephone. [17:44] vZS1 All I want is something to use at home for just the apps [17:44] MinceR i'm waiting for a pinephone that doesn't have the logo of a cancerd distribution on it [17:44] vZS1 I don't care about having it on me outside [17:45] XRevan86 MinceR: Will a beta-quality Android port do it for you? [17:45] vZS1 I'll just use a dumbphone [17:45] schestowitz laptops work outside [17:45] MinceR XRevan86: it's supposed to be replaceable [17:45] schestowitz some of them with battery life comparable to that of a 'phone' [17:45] MinceR one of the selling points is that it can boot from removable devices [17:46] schestowitz vZS1: raspi is the same, I try not to say RaPi as it sounds like "rape" [17:46] vZS1 I just say Rpi [17:46] MinceR rapiscan! [17:46] schestowitz that too [17:46] schestowitz I thought of that minutes ago [17:46] XRevan86 MinceR: So boot Android from a removeable device, I won't stop you :D [17:47] MinceR i'd rather boot Maemo Leste [17:48] XRevan86 MinceR: Make a beta-quality Maemo Leste port for it, I won't stop you here as well. [17:48] MinceR i thought other people were doing that already [17:48] XRevan86 UBports probably still uses Upstart, but there's no guarantee it will stay that way. [17:49] vZS1 If I can get Android on a Rpi, I can just use D-droid with Aurora for stuff like Banking apps [17:49] XRevan86 MinceR: Oh, indeed. [17:50] vZS1 s/D-droid/F-droid [17:51] schestowitz XRevan86: http://techrights.org/wiki/index.php/New_buffer_2:2 [17:51] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org | New buffer 2:2 - Techrights [17:51] schestowitz read the comment from fig at the topr [17:51] schestowitz regarding shithub [17:53] MinceR (cat) (no audio) https://i.imgur.com/WhyC3xz.mp4 [17:58] DaemonFC[m] "A Pennsylvania judge ruled in favor of the Trump campaign Thursday, ordering that the state may not count ballots where the voters needed to provide proof of identification and failed to do so by Nov. 9." [17:59] XRevan86 > In dozens of ways, Democrats are to progress what Open Source is to Free Software-- they only care if they win, they don't care how many principles they have to sacrifice to do it. [17:59] XRevan86 I like it how there's no clarification about what is meant by "Democrat". The default country meaning, of course. [17:59] DaemonFC[m] Not enough to get anywhere close to changing the outcome. [17:59] DaemonFC[m] May affect a couple hundred votes out of millions in the entire state. [17:59] DaemonFC[m] Fox News ran with it and didn't mention that part. ● Nov 13 [18:00] schestowitz Faux Noise [18:00] schestowitz DaemonFC[m]: see screenshot of "FOX" here http://techrights.org/2020/11/04/2020-election/ [18:00] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org | 2020 Election Like 2016 Election Serves to Show Social Control Media is Disinformation Machine, a Growing Threat to Democracies | Techrights [18:02] XRevan86 schestowitz: Well, they're not wrong. [18:03] vZS1 I don't see why fig interpreted "GPL is dead" as "all software with GPL should be thrown away". Those are two entirely different statements. [18:04] XRevan86 Maybe a bit too harsh for my taste, but shithub is still a monopoly, so maybe a guilt trip is not unwarranted, don't know. [18:05] vZS1 GAFAM have been running GPL software on their clouds (modified, possibly) and the original devs get nothing out of it. How much worse does it have to get before they relicense to AGPL or similar. [18:06] XRevan86 It's all those little individual contributions that add up to Microsoft's servers being the place where one goes for software. [18:08] vZS1 Valve have been aggressively developing Steam on Ubuntu. Watch MS lose one of their key userbases once Steam starts to run better on Ubuntu. [18:08] vZS1 And Proton* [18:09] MinceR watch microshit sue valve over the winblows API when that happens [18:09] MinceR and put "features" into Linux that cripple steamOS [18:09] MinceR and maybe ibm will help them out too [18:09] MinceR valve has really dropped the ball on steamOS [18:09] vZS1 A lot of games have native Linux support [18:10] vZS1 All Valve titles do, afaik [18:10] MinceR steamOS still depends on systemd and proton, doesn't it? [18:10] vZS1 I don't know [18:11] vZS1 People are already using Steam on FreeBSD as well [18:12] vZS1 This is going to hit MS where it really hurts [18:12] vZS1 Bottom line sales figures [18:12] MinceR but not on any of the CoC-less BSD-s, of course [18:13] schestowitz vZS1: than we worry about DRM [18:14] schestowitz but to be fair [18:14] schestowitz if you wean them off Windows [18:14] schestowitz it's a good start [18:14] schestowitz as they'd use DRM there as well [18:14] schestowitz better bring them over to our fold, let Microsoft fold over [18:14] vZS1 I've tried a lot of titles on Proton. All the games I've tried work fine [18:14] MinceR it's not "our fold" though [18:14] schestowitz they waste their money bribing the likes of Guido van Icaza [18:14] MinceR it's ibm's systemd running on top of microsoft linux, offering win32 API via proton [18:14] schestowitz to give a false impression they still have "dev cred" [18:15] MinceR and the longer they stick to those, the more difficult it will be to ever fix it [18:15] schestowitz with directX [18:15] schestowitz https://airlied.blogspot.com/2020/08/vallium-software-swrast-vulkan-layer-faq.html [18:15] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-airlied.blogspot.com | lavapipe: a *software* swrast vulkan layer FAQ [18:15] schestowitz https://airlied.blogspot.com/2020/08/vallium-software-swrast-vulkan-layer-faq.html [18:15] MinceR that too [18:18] vZS1 I might turn those printf statements into logger statements, for the IPFS stuff. Since everything is running via cron now [18:19] vZS1 I'll do that tomorrow [18:19] -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Oracle Linux 8.3 Is Out and It Brings a Much Improved Installer, SELinux Updates http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144337 [https://pleroma.site/objects/b2cc4b02-79a3-4064-95ef-92bff44f182e] [18:19] MinceR https://img.pr0gramm.com/2020/09/20/20cb4b78142736d7.jpg [18:20] *aguyy has quit (Quit: http://www.kiwiirc.com/ - A hand crafted IRC client) [18:22] DaemonFC[m] I noticed Aldi is only about 3-4 cents per can cheaper than Walmart. [18:23] DaemonFC[m] So it only really makes sense to go in there every couple months to fill up a shopping cart with them and buy in bulk. [18:23] DaemonFC[m] That way you may save $50 a year on canned goods and only have to go in there 5-6 times. [18:24] DaemonFC[m] I don't like having a lot of fresh vegetables around to cook with when you can just rinse most of the sodium out of each can anyway. [18:24] DaemonFC[m] You can balance things out by reducing salt somewhere else to compensate. [18:25] DaemonFC[m] Mom seems to be smart enough to figure out the United States might collapse. [18:26] DaemonFC[m] Not smart enough to see it was because of Trump and if it somehow does not, only because he was defeated after one term. [18:26] vZS1 Once I'm done with the messy work, I'll start working on migrating my Pi to OpenBSD. I've checked the docs and it looks like OpenBSD has drivers for the ethernet controller on my Rpi model. [18:32] DaemonFC[m] schestowitz: I need to sync my phone. [18:32] DaemonFC[m] I got the USB charge and 3.5 mm adapter for it. [18:32] DaemonFC[m] Pain in the ass but it's whatever I guess. [18:33] DaemonFC[m] I knew all the best songs to skewer Maricel with over Thanksgiving last year with her karaoke machine after she snubbed us. [18:35] DaemonFC[m] I might buy one of those stupid things. [18:35] DaemonFC[m] I've been told I have a great singing voice. [18:35] DaemonFC[m] She was over there fuming while her mother/father-in-law were complimenting me. [18:39] MinceR (audio) https://vid.pr0gramm.com/2020/09/20/643f8a6da97cb406.mp4 [18:39] -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: markets track stock, currency, and cryptocurrency http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144339 [https://pleroma.site/objects/134d5582-f09a-475c-b9fd-1b124c5068c0] [18:41] vZS1 Huh [18:41] vZS1 Interesting [18:41] vZS1 OpenBSD has the latest go-ipfs already packaged [18:42] vZS1 Just checked on openports.se [18:45] vZS1 Why the hell does neither Debian nor Ubuntu have go-ipfs packages. What kind of bullshittery is this [18:45] vZS1 Not that's it's hard to just grab the binaries [18:46] vZS1 s/that's/that [18:49] *vZS1_2 (~vZS1_2@host-92-20-231-81.as13285.net) has joined #techrights [18:49] DaemonFC[m] I don't know why anyone would be buying Intel Macs right now. [18:50] DaemonFC[m] Apple isn't even discounting them and they announced an architecture change. [18:50] vZS1_2 You know, the new Raspberry Pi models function just fine as a desktop computer. [18:51] vZS1_2 I don't own a Rpi 4 model but you can get an 8GB RAM model a lot cheaper than a laptop. [18:51] DaemonFC[m] Yeah, but I noticed a lot of laptops in the $1,100 range don't even have the stuff my late 2016 one came with. [18:51] DaemonFC[m] It has 16 GB RAM, 512 GB NVME SSD, and a 4K screen. [18:51] vZS1_2 That's because modern PCs/laptops are a scam [18:51] DaemonFC[m] And they're back to FHD, 8 GB RAM, 256 GB SSD. [18:52] vZS1_2 Unless you build your own PC [18:52] DaemonFC[m] What the fuck.... [18:52] -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Games: CoreCtrl, October Night Games, Mad Experiments: Escape Room, Sail Forth http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144341 [https://pleroma.site/objects/beb3c353-3746-4454-a45f-7eb26b053af3] [18:52] vZS1_2 I've assembled my own PC years ago, and it's still great. [18:52] DaemonFC[m] 8 GB generally probably still works fine on Linux. [18:52] DaemonFC[m] But on Windows 10? REALLY? [18:53] MinceR i don't know why anyone would be buying apple products right now [18:53] schestowitz few do [18:53] schestowitz but apple has large profit margins on each [18:53] DaemonFC[m] It's always been a rule of thumb that you take whatever amount of RAM Linux can run decently with and double it and that's what you need to do the same things on Windows. [18:53] schestowitz because some people with limited resources ae dumb [18:53] MinceR and they save a lot on engineering [18:53] MinceR as they don't do any [18:53] schestowitz they'd borrow thinking white shitty "computers" with glorified logo would elevate their social status [18:54] DaemonFC[m] Windows has always been the more RAM you throw at it the better, and even then it's usually not enough. [18:54] DaemonFC[m] It's terrible. [18:54] DaemonFC[m] You can run it with 4 times or 8 times the minimum and it still manages to run out and thrash. [18:55] *rianne_ has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) [18:55] *rianne_ (~rianne@host81-154-173-112.range81-154.btcentralplus.com) has joined #techrights [18:55] DaemonFC[m] schestowitz: These Gateway laptops that Walmart has on rollback are actually some of the most decent specs I've seen anywhere at this price point. [18:56] DaemonFC[m] And yes, they have 16 GB of RAM in a $479 laptop, so if they can do that, then why can't LOL NO!-vo do it for 2-3 times the price? [18:56] schestowitz https://www.maketecheasier.com/google-storage-will-cost-you-delete-files/ [18:56] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.maketecheasier.com | Google Storage Will Cost You and Delete Your Files - Make Tech Easier [18:56] schestowitz butter emails! [18:57] vZS1_2 I have a 4GHZ processor (8 cores), 8GB RAM, quite a few SSDs, 1 HDD, GTX 1050Ti. I only spent a few hundred . [18:58] vZS1_2 If I need to upgrade, I just buy a new part and put it in my current case. [18:58] schestowitz makes sense [18:58] schestowitz partical [18:58] schestowitz practical [18:58] vZS1_2 Yeah [18:58] schestowitz I retired my older main workstation this year, after 11 years [18:58] vZS1_2 It's cheap too [18:58] vZS1_2 And I can slap whatever OS I want on SSDs [18:59] schestowitz long enough service, impossible to repair anymore (I tried) [18:59] schestowitz vZS1_2: http://schestowitz.com/Weblog/archives/2020/05/05/budget-setup/ [18:59] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-schestowitz.com Blog Archive 6 Heads Under $1000 [18:59] MinceR https://img.pr0gramm.com/2020/09/19/2c142a9681c95d13.jpg [18:59] schestowitz the setup changes a little over time ● Nov 13 [19:00] vZS1_2 I buy these budget brand spyphones called Oukitel. They're pretty decent. Only cost around 80. [19:00] schestowitz less and less as the "right" setup is being approaches, less neck movement etc. [19:00] MinceR phones for spies? [19:00] vZS1_2 I don't get people blowing a couple grand on a new phone/computer. Makes no sense to me. [19:00] schestowitz phones "for" [19:01] schestowitz are [19:01] schestowitz or [19:01] schestowitz working not for their supposed owners [19:01] schestowitz but for spies that tap onto them [19:01] schestowitz remotelt [19:01] schestowitz *y [19:01] schestowitz vZS1_2: makes sense to the OEMs [19:01] vZS1_2 80* [19:01] schestowitz lots of money in profit margins [19:01] DaemonFC[m] Walmart generally only makes about 15% on computers that they sell. [19:01] schestowitz and then the buyers brag about how much it costs them [19:02] schestowitz to me, they brag about being gullible [19:02] schestowitz like people who buy some premium food just for the name [19:02] DaemonFC[m] 12-15% [19:02] DaemonFC[m] The higher margins are on the ones that are total junk though. [19:02] schestowitz 2 quid for ice cream you can buy for 50p [19:02] DaemonFC[m] Like those "RCA" Android tablets. [19:03] schestowitz lol RCA [19:03] schestowitz I once bought an RCA tuner when I was in Florida [19:03] schestowitz iirc, it was already made in China [19:03] schestowitz that was 1990s [19:03] vZS1_2 I buy old laptops when I see a good deal, sometimes. But I gave all but 1 of them away. [19:03] schestowitz vZS1_2: PCWorld has outlets [19:04] schestowitz slightly used stuff. My oldest laptop in use right now cost just 120 quid IIRC [19:04] vZS1_2 I don't shop at chains [19:04] vZS1_2 So I wouldn't know. I'll give PCWorld a look sometime. [19:04] schestowitz i've still kept the plastic on the screen, oddly enough [19:04] schestowitz after 5 years [19:05] schestowitz vZS1_2: outlet [19:05] vZS1_2 Ah okay [19:05] schestowitz you can get really cheap junk there sometimes [19:05] vZS1_2 Will definitely to rummage around then. ty! [19:06] schestowitz and if there's a fault in first 12 months, they'll swap it [19:06] schestowitz my navatech computer did not last long [19:06] vZS1_2 Sounds like a pretty good deal. [19:06] schestowitz maybe 5 years reliably, even 4 [19:06] schestowitz then partly functional, then piece of junk [19:06] schestowitz came with no OS [19:07] schestowitz *novatech [19:07] vZS1_2 When I go to a hotel or something, I usually just take my Pi along with me. Hook it up to the TV and use it like that. [19:07] vZS1_2 I always have a spare keyboard or 2 in my rucksack [19:07] vZS1_2 1 bluetooth and 1 USB, usually [19:07] schestowitz buuuu but... [19:07] schestowitz why not SMAART phone [19:07] vZS1_2 I have a spyphone as well [19:07] schestowitz it's not like you need a legible display [19:08] schestowitz or a KEYBOARD [19:08] schestowitz or mousing [19:08] schestowitz tap, tap... [19:08] schestowitz zoom [19:08] schestowitz press "like" [19:08] vZS1_2 I didn't know about Android on Rpi. I did some searching and it looks pretty mature. I might just carry a spare Pi for that. Get a touchscreen module. [19:09] vZS1_2 Tbf, bluetooth keyboards work pretty well with spyphones. [19:09] vZS1_2 I've been using them for years without issue. [19:09] vZS1_2 I don't like touch screen typing. [19:11] schestowitz it's not typing [19:11] schestowitz it's tapping [19:11] schestowitz imagine typewriters like that [19:11] schestowitz you don't know what you press [19:11] schestowitz even the feedback sounds don't help [19:11] schestowitz you type "shift" [19:11] schestowitz it corrects it to "shit" [19:11] schestowitz and similar blunders [19:11] schestowitz I tried from the gym a few times [19:11] schestowitz it would 'correct' fine words [19:12] schestowitz repeatedly spewing out garbage [19:12] schestowitz even into this channel [19:12] schestowitz on a cycling machine with android/chrome [19:12] schestowitz can't imagine how anyone could get serious work done on these things [19:12] schestowitz here's a proposition for a study [19:12] vZS1_2 I use mine like a pager [19:12] schestowitz look into productivity loss induced by 'smart' things [19:13] schestowitz in the past people rushed home... to work on real equipment [19:13] schestowitz now they stretch their day to scroll and droll on some 'phone' [19:13] schestowitz *drool [19:13] vZS1_2 Yeah, no. I can't do any real work that isn't on a proper computer. [19:13] schestowitz to a lot of people "work" is not "socialising" by pressing "like" in timelines [19:13] schestowitz because in exchange they "like" yours [19:14] schestowitz and their you look like some popular socialite [19:14] schestowitz and this is the depressing shit many sink into [19:14] vZS1_2 I've got a lot of productivity apps on my phone though [19:14] schestowitz trying to keep up with all the other fakers [19:14] vZS1_2 Like my break timer [19:14] schestowitz they could find real hobbies instead [19:14] vZS1_2 It does intervals and everthing [19:14] schestowitz learn to paint or something [19:14] schestowitz you don't need a phone for that [19:14] vZS1_2 And I can have it in my pocket and it makes a really loud, obscene noise to tell me to get back to work [19:15] schestowitz you don't even need that timing to be strict [19:15] vZS1_2 And other things like workout counters [19:15] schestowitz I used to overuse my Palm PDA [19:15] schestowitz I put ALL the tasks in it [19:15] vZS1_2 A calendar (not Google) [19:15] schestowitz and later realised I could improvise a bit and todo.txt at home only would be enough [19:15] vZS1_2 for daily reminders [19:15] vZS1_2 Weekly maintenance tasks [19:15] vZS1_2 I have a terrible memory [19:15] schestowitz workouts don't need counting either [19:15] schestowitz I used to count sets and reps a lot [19:15] schestowitz but the body doesn't count [19:15] schestowitz it doesn't matter [19:16] schestowitz it can only ever cause stress and mental overload [19:16] schestowitz keeping track of numbes [19:16] schestowitz numbers [19:16] schestowitz I'll get you a video on thay [19:16] schestowitz hang on [19:16] vZS1_2 It works fine for me [19:16] schestowitz I think this is the one http://techrights.org/2019/11/24/republica-2019-eben-moglen-talk/ [19:16] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org | Prof. Moglen on Privacy and Social Control Media | Techrights [19:16] schestowitz unless we posted several of his [19:17] schestowitz al this notifications flood and signal overload is not helping you [19:17] schestowitz I used to be like that until a decade back [19:17] schestowitz and many who use 'phones' also upload their data that they log to the "cloud" [19:17] schestowitz thankfully I didn't have "the cloud" back then [19:17] vZS1_2 I don't have notifications. My phone is always muted. The only notification I get is the timer that tells me to stretch. [19:17] schestowitz you can do it without a timer [19:18] schestowitz not everything need to be programmed, you're not a robot [19:18] schestowitz *needs [19:18] schestowitz the timer might even interrupt something you do or think about [19:18] vZS1_2 Eh. I get too absorbed when I'm working on things. I need a loud noise to tell me to get off my arse. [19:19] vZS1_2 I have a system of task tracking that means that doesn't really happen. [19:19] vZS1_2 But that's on paper and not my phone [19:19] vZS1_2 I use little post-it notes like pointers [19:20] vZS1_2 It's pretty neat [19:20] schestowitz I was in that position before [19:20] schestowitz I learned from that mistake [19:20] schestowitz my aunt bought me a PDA [19:20] schestowitz and I started putting more and more things into it [19:20] schestowitz with alarms and all [19:20] vZS1_2 You do you [19:20] schestowitz later on I realised it was not so needed [19:20] schestowitz I was fine before that as well [19:21] schestowitz I still have my full Palm archives [19:21] schestowitz I never ever access them, no practical need to [19:21] schestowitz Spending lots of time archiving daily routines gives you nothing, maybe gives data-selling 'brokers' value [19:21] schestowitz as they can automate the mining [19:21] schestowitz and use that to maniplate you [19:22] vZS1_2 I don't archive anything [19:22] schestowitz *manipulate [19:22] schestowitz vZS1_2: you don't, others do [19:22] schestowitz employer, friends [19:22] schestowitz so archiving is still a problem [19:22] schestowitz this channel is also logged/archived, albeit we redact names [19:25] vZS1_2 I'm fine with my current setup. [19:25] vZS1_2 I've refined it over years. [19:26] schestowitz you do not overuse bad devices [19:26] schestowitz but... [19:26] schestowitz some do, so I'm partly talking to a fictional you [19:26] schestowitz to make a point [19:26] schestowitz I have a friend who's a medical prof [19:27] schestowitz friend for over a decade [19:27] schestowitz sometimes he sits in the changing room with his 'smart' phone [19:27] schestowitz for like 20 minutes [19:27] schestowitz checking mail [19:27] vZS1_2 That's a lack of self control [19:27] schestowitz I say, go home, use a real computer [19:27] schestowitz 20 minutes on a pew won't be as good as his quad-head PC [19:28] schestowitz no keyboard, tiny screen, not even good posture, leaning forward [19:28] schestowitz and he's not unique in that regard [19:28] schestowitz many people sit in public transport never looking out the window [19:28] schestowitz the notion becomes outlandish [19:28] *rodolphoeck (~rodolphoe@dzcpe8910olorag-e0.static-hfc.datazug.ch) has joined #techrights [19:29] schestowitz people who should know better, but those things are being designed deliberately to be >Addictive< [19:29] schestowitz I wasted tons of time replying to people in Twitter [19:29] schestowitz years [19:29] schestowitz now -- not anymore, it's also low quality of communications and it's farmed for sale [19:30] schestowitz on Twitter I spent maybe 2 minutes a day, just quickly glancing at replies [19:30] vZS1_2 I don't have the mental energy for that kind of thing. [19:30] schestowitz now it'd disgusting to even go to that site, I have to force myself to go there [19:30] vZS1_2 That's why I don't use social media [19:30] schestowitz in the past it was hard to NOT go there to check responses -- the exactly opposite [19:31] schestowitz same with Palm PDA diary or those notifications you say you get [19:31] vZS1_2 Like you said, those things are designed to be addictive. [19:31] schestowitz yup [19:31] schestowitz they study it [19:31] schestowitz how to increase "engagement" or screen time [19:31] schestowitz go to twitter and see "trending" [19:31] schestowitz it's the "you will never believe what happened next!" type [19:31] schestowitz cryptic [19:31] schestowitz provocative [19:31] schestowitz misleading [19:32] schestowitz all just to keep your mind from working properly [19:32] vZS1_2 It's worse for children [19:32] schestowitz so I visualised it http://techrights.org/2020/07/24/twitter-annotated/ [19:32] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org | How Social Control Media Works: The Case of Twitter, Visualised and Annotated | Techrights [19:32] schestowitz Twitter was not always like that [19:32] vZS1_2 Look at how much advertising is done to children on YouTube [19:32] schestowitz it became another FB [19:32] schestowitz copying the same addictive traits [19:32] vZS1_2 On TV channels, at least advertising time is limited [19:33] schestowitz https://truthout.org/articles/trump-ran-a-false-ad-in-florida-tying-biden-to-venezuelan-socialists/ [19:33] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-truthout.org | Trump Ran a False Ad in Florida Tying Biden to Venezuelan Socialists [19:33] schestowitz youtube [19:33] schestowitz this is the latest link I posted a couple minutes ago in social control media [19:33] schestowitz http://techrights.org/2020/11/04/2020-election/ [19:33] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org | 2020 Election Like 2016 Election Serves to Show Social Control Media is Disinformation Machine, a Growing Threat to Democracies | Techrights [19:33] schestowitz many people think wrong things [19:33] schestowitz based on no evidence [19:33] schestowitz and it's hard to convince them otherwise [19:34] schestowitz social control media = cults and bubbles [19:34] vZS1_2 And it's not just Google Ads on YouTube; YouTubers constantly plug things to children as well. A lot of videos have over 50% just adversiting content. [19:34] schestowitz mental asylums with balkanised 'communities' [19:34] schestowitz vZS1_2: some of the "content" is astroturfing [19:34] vZS1_2 It should be illegal for children to be on platforms like that [19:34] schestowitz like "influencers" who "promote" products [19:34] schestowitz basically ads disguised as recommendations [19:35] schestowitz it's truly disturbing [19:35] vZS1_2 That's what I mean [19:35] DaemonFC[m] schestowitz: Almost certain that Illinois has another lockdown at this point. [19:35] DaemonFC[m] Over 15,000 new cases today. [19:35] schestowitz good, do a lockdown [19:35] *rodolphoeck has quit (Quit: WeeChat 2.9) [19:36] schestowitz DaemonFC[m]: https://truthout.org/articles/covid-19-expected-to-overwhelm-health-care-system-as-trump-sabotages-transition/ [19:36] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-truthout.org | COVID-19 Expected to Overwhelm Health Care System as Trump Sabotages Transition [19:36] DaemonFC[m] Positivity rate of 13.2% in the last week. [19:36] schestowitz DaemonFC[m]: the number of cases is decreasing here, I checked an hour ago [19:36] schestowitz 400 or so per 100,000 [19:36] schestowitz i.e. 0.4% are infected, based on the tested or those tested [19:36] schestowitz and that's considered very high [19:36] DaemonFC[m] https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/secret-service-coronavirus-outbreak/2020/11/13/610eebcc-2539-11eb-8672-c281c7a2c96e_story.html [19:37] schestowitz national average about 0.15% [19:37] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.washingtonpost.com | More than 130 Secret Service officers are said to be infected with coronavirus or quarantining in wake of Trumps campaign travel - The Washington Post [19:37] schestowitz but that's for active cases and confirmed ones [19:37] schestowitz no asymptomatic for the most part [19:37] DaemonFC[m] They deserve it for firing tear gas and rubber bullets at people so that Trump could spend 2 minutes holding a bible outside a church for a photo op; [19:37] schestowitz I will use that link, cheers [19:37] schestowitz for Daily Links [19:37] DaemonFC[m] "The virus is having a dramatic impact on the Secret Services presidential security unit at the same time that growing numbers of prominent Trump campaign allies and White House officials have fallen ill in the wake of campaign events, where many attendees did not wear masks." [19:38] DaemonFC[m] "Among those who are infected are White House Chief of Staff Mark Meadows and outside political advisers Corey Lewandowski and David Bossie. [19:38] DaemonFC[m] In addition, at least eight staffers at the Republican National Committee, including Chief of Staff Richard Walters, have the virus, according to officials at the organization. Some of those infected are in field offices across the country, including Pennsylvania, where some believe they were exposed in large staff gatherings, an official said." [19:38] vZS1_2 Thing is: were they forced to not wear masks? [19:38] DaemonFC[m] "White House spokesman Judd Deere said the administration takes every case seriously." [19:38] DaemonFC[m] Just not seriously enough to do anything about. [19:38] schestowitz they're supposed to protect them [19:38] schestowitz not infect them [19:38] schestowitz LOL! [19:39] DaemonFC[m] Almost 10 more weeks of this pig fuck left before Biden can possibly do anything to alter course. [19:39] DaemonFC[m] Speaking of course, Trump is on the golf course, of course. [19:39] schestowitz like Bush and his 'ranch' [19:39] schestowitz what a bunch of buffoons [19:39] DaemonFC[m] Only now on his 450th day of golf is the media saying he's abdicating. [19:39] schestowitz with their "lifestyles" and "toil" [19:40] schestowitz he left his legacy [19:40] schestowitz friends with North Korea [19:40] schestowitz and US lost so many worthwhile allies [19:40] DaemonFC[m] https://www.cnn.com/2020/11/13/politics/arizona-trump-lawsuit/index.html [19:40] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-Arizona presidential election: Trump campaign drops lawsuit demanding a review of ballots - CNNPolitics [19:40] DaemonFC[m] Then there's this. [19:40] DaemonFC[m] He's giving up, at least in Arizona. [19:40] DaemonFC[m] So the election will be certified there on schedule. [19:40] schestowitz yup [19:41] vZS1_2 Isn't the Senate and SCOTUS stacked against Biden? [19:41] DaemonFC[m] He no longer has any realistic plan to deny Biden at least 270 electoral votes. [19:41] DaemonFC[m] Well, if Trump drops the lawsuit against Arizona then he can't get to 270. [19:41] vZS1_2 I haven't been keeping up with US news. [19:41] DaemonFC[m] There's nothing even remotely realistic to be done about Michigan, Wisconsin, or Nevada. [19:41] DaemonFC[m] And that's 270. So, yeah. [19:42] schestowitz fin [19:42] DaemonFC[m] Then Georgia is plowing along and says the audit absolutely will be done by the 20th, with their Secretary of State quarantined with Coronavirus. [19:42] schestowitz now he'll rule up cults [19:42] DaemonFC[m] o 16 more there. [19:42] schestowitz base45, kkk, proud boys [19:42] schestowitz to cause violence [19:42] schestowitz *rile up [19:42] DaemonFC[m] Yeah, he made a halfassed challenge to the election that would never go anywhere so he could say he was cheated and keep hitting people up for money. [19:43] DaemonFC[m] Guessing he's tapping out because the coffers aren't exactly overflowing with donations at this point. [19:43] schestowitz not even Oracle Larrison? [19:43] DaemonFC[m] He's a grifter, but he's smart enough to give up when the cost of grifting is exceeding the pace of the "grifted" who will still open their wallets. [19:43] schestowitz https://www.counterpunch.org/2020/11/12/things-may-get-worse-before-they-get-better-in-the-u-s/ [19:43] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-Things May Get Worse Before They Get Better in the U.S. - CounterPunch.org [19:44] schestowitz grift: https://www.commondreams.org/news/2020/11/12/trumps-election-lies-continue-so-does-his-extremely-misleading-fundraising-grift [19:44] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.commondreams.org | As Trump's Election Lies Continue, So Does His "Extremely Misleading" Fundraising Grift | Common Dreams News [19:44] DaemonFC[m] schestowitz: Well, giving up on lawsuits, taking petty revenges upon officials who had less than 70 days left before Biden got rid of them anyway.... [19:44] DaemonFC[m] Disappeared from public view... [19:44] DaemonFC[m] This is hardly a guy coming up swinging and on his way to a new term. [19:45] DaemonFC[m] The only thing Trump's accomplishing by sacking people is sparing Biden the effort and making his outgoing administration less efficient at causing trouble. [19:45] schestowitz but the damage is done [19:45] DaemonFC[m] Yeah? [19:45] schestowitz he prevents reform [19:45] schestowitz transition [19:45] schestowitz meanwhile the virus spreads at quadratic pace [19:45] DaemonFC[m] He's not preventing anything, really. [19:46] schestowitz and it'll take another months for those infested to die, even if just the older ones die [19:46] DaemonFC[m] The Senate Republicans have had enough and said they will start providing the Biden Transition with the National Security reports that they have. [19:46] DaemonFC[m] So that's fine. [19:46] schestowitz DaemonFC[m]: no election anymore, nothing to lose [19:46] schestowitz making a bigger mess for Biden [19:46] schestowitz maybe that's the goal [19:46] schestowitz to make him look bad [19:46] schestowitz force lockdown [19:46] schestowitz Wall Street collapses [19:46] schestowitz I hope it happens BEFORE inauguration [19:46] DaemonFC[m] schestowitz: It was going there anyway. [19:46] schestowitz and then the public will know WHO to blame [19:47] DaemonFC[m] He had no reason to do anything if he won either. [19:47] DaemonFC[m] Term limits. [19:47] schestowitz how many cases in US so far today? [19:47] *schestowitz promised self not to check the numbers anymore, except very selectively [19:47] DaemonFC[m] 85,203 so far. [19:47] DaemonFC[m] With 6 hours left on the clock. [19:47] schestowitz it's only 2pm in ny/east coat [19:47] schestowitz it's only 2pm in ny/east coast [19:47] schestowitz ET [19:48] schestowitz 2:47 [19:48] DaemonFC[m] schestowitz: It's got two more years to play out. [19:48] schestowitz those last 6 hours are when all the actual numbers come in [19:48] DaemonFC[m] Killing the elderly, mostly. [19:48] schestowitz you can see which states have not reported yet [19:48] DaemonFC[m] The Republicans are not going to do very well in the midterms with that. [19:48] schestowitz and extrapolate based on past days [19:48] DaemonFC[m] If this thing kills a million more old people. [19:49] DaemonFC[m] schestowitz: 150,000-170,000 most likely. [19:49] schestowitz it KILLS older people, but harms younger ones also [19:49] schestowitz so their lives are shortened [19:49] schestowitz yet the media treats no fatalities as "no big deal", "carry on" [19:49] DaemonFC[m] schestowitz: Did you hear the latest Trump Jr. conspiracy? [19:49] vZS1_2 We don't even know what happens to people with covid-19, in the long term. [19:49] schestowitz and later they get infected again,not even with a mutated version [19:50] vZS1_2 As in, after a "full recovery". [19:50] DaemonFC[m] That Pfizer delayed the news about the effectiveness of their vaccine in order to cause Trump to lose the election. [19:50] schestowitz vZS1_2: there's some data [19:50] schestowitz cardiac effect [19:50] DaemonFC[m] I knew that was coming from....someone. [19:50] schestowitz nerves [19:50] schestowitz lungs [19:50] schestowitz mental [19:50] DaemonFC[m] Like Pfizer cares who the goddamned president is. [19:50] schestowitz I'm 90% we did not contract it yet [19:50] DaemonFC[m] Nobody is going to stop them, [19:50] schestowitz one of us would show some symptoms [19:51] schestowitz the wife is 42 [19:51] schestowitz Pfizer wrote a press release [19:51] schestowitz no data released [19:51] schestowitz many bought into it based on words in a press release and paid-for media coverage [19:51] schestowitz so think another AstraZeneca [19:51] schestowitz but better marketed [19:51] schestowitz it's too early [19:52] vZS1_2 In another 5 years, we'll see what the stats say. [19:52] schestowitz to even test full recovery [19:52] schestowitz let alone side effects [19:52] schestowitz proper trial would take 10-15 years [19:52] schestowitz 5 if rushed [19:52] schestowitz Bill Gates might be dead by then, like his dad [19:52] schestowitz dead dad, died 2 months ago [19:52] schestowitz vZS1_2: big sample set [19:53] schestowitz if they can get a billion people to take multiple doses of the thing [19:53] DaemonFC[m] In addition to the canned goods this morning, I finished off the freezer with marked down meat last night. [19:53] DaemonFC[m] And bought another 16 pound bag of cat food and 80 pounds of litter. [19:53] DaemonFC[m] The cats should be good for at least 6 months. [19:53] schestowitz whoa [19:54] schestowitz when do you dig up your bunker, Yankee boy ? :-) [19:54] DaemonFC[m] The stores are having....issues, with cat supplies. [19:54] DaemonFC[m] Especially in the bulk sizes where you save a couple bucks. [19:54] DaemonFC[m] So, eh... [19:54] vZS1_2 I have pickled foods and other preserved goods always on standby. A lot of tinned provisions as well. [19:54] DaemonFC[m] Worst that happens is nothing happens and we use it anyway, right? [19:54] vZS1_2 Extended family used to pick up stuff from me when the stores were really bad here. [19:54] schestowitz https://www.commondreams.org/news/2020/11/12/trump-whines-and-gaslights-heres-reality-check-he-got-his-ass-kicked-general [19:54] DaemonFC[m] If they run out of food or litter I'm in trouble. [19:54] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.commondreams.org | As Trump Whines and Gaslights, Here's a Reality Check: He Got His Ass Kicked in the General Election | Common Dreams News [19:55] DaemonFC[m] We can eat just about any damned thing I find. [19:55] DaemonFC[m] They need cat food. [19:55] schestowitz vZS1_2: useful for brexshit kicking in [19:55] schestowitz brex-shit-canned [19:56] DaemonFC[m] schestowitz: I managed to claim $600-something for mom from the Indiana unclaimed property dept. [19:56] vZS1_2 I don't want to go anywhere near that can [19:56] schestowitz https://truthout.org/articles/4-weeks-of-lockdown-could-stop-covid-flare-up-boost-economy-says-biden-adviser/ [19:56] DaemonFC[m] A bill collector kept garnishing her bank account for a month past the bankruptcy and then tried to return the money and couldn't find her. [19:56] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-truthout.org | 4 Weeks of Lockdown Could Stop COVID Flare-Up, Boost Economy, Says Biden Adviser ● Nov 13 [20:00] vZS1_2 I make sure the pantry at home is always enough to live off for at least 2 months. Never know when disaster might strike. Covid proved me right. [20:01] vZS1_2 When climate change really kicks in, it might be a lot worse than covid. [20:01] -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: It Came From the Live-Boot: A True Linux Horror Story http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144342 [https://pleroma.site/objects/6e7ac43d-5a4e-47bd-ab2b-846b17769f78] [20:05] DaemonFC[m] https://edition.cnn.com/2020/11/13/politics/law-firm-biden-trump-pennsylvania/index.html [20:05] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-edition.cnn.com | Law firm attempting to block Biden's win in Pennsylvania leaves controversial Trump campaign case - CNNPolitics [20:06] DaemonFC[m] https://edition.cnn.com/2020/11/13/politics/trump-michigan-election/index.html [20:06] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-edition.cnn.com | Michigan judge rejects demand to block certification of Biden win in Detroit - CNNPolitics [20:08] -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Wonderwall Wallaper Manager with Huge Collection of Wallpapers http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144343 [https://pleroma.site/objects/e81b513f-4e10-4016-b21b-430d616ada43] [20:11] -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Noscript cures font vulnerabilities http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144344 [https://pleroma.site/objects/2ff279f3-312b-4e9c-8d5b-604d89d1fba9] [20:14] -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Todays #HowTos | #UNIX http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144345 [https://pleroma.site/objects/a1a55be4-49ca-4516-bbcc-c29837022e6a] [20:16] schestowitz [20:01] When climate change really kicks in, it might be a lot worse than covid. [20:17] schestowitz I kicked in, really, just not here (yet) [20:17] schestowitz [19:56] [Notice] -viera to #boycottnovell-social- Dr. Roy Schestowitz (): NEWS #TruthOut #Climate Refugees Will Soon Surpass Those Displaced by #War https://truthout.org/articles/climate-refugees-will-soon-surpass-those-displaced-by-war/ [https://pleroma.site/objects/d7963526-ca0f-4a79-8015-e0d6fc3a8a03] [20:17] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-truthout.org | Climate Refugees Will Soon Surpass Those Displaced by War [20:17] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-pleroma.site [20:17] schestowitz vZS1_2: usually low-surface islands [20:17] vZS1_2 Yeah but things will get a lot worse, the way things are going now. [20:17] vZS1_2 Certain countries are already going underwater. [20:17] schestowitz we're accustomed to large food supplies [20:17] schestowitz cheaply [20:18] schestowitz many crops were lost for good in asia due to the storms [20:18] schestowitz no food security [20:18] schestowitz harvest in a hurry before fields got flooded [20:18] schestowitz much food still lost [20:18] schestowitz brexshit cult assumes rice just comes in plastic [20:18] schestowitz from "the boat" or "the lorry" [20:19] schestowitz no matter who actually does the hard work and where [20:19] vZS1_2 Many of the countries that export rice flood frequently [20:20] vZS1_2 Going underwater isn't helping things [20:20] vZS1_2 I've lived in them, so I've seen it first hand. [20:22] schestowitz they will feed their own first [20:22] schestowitz no exports [20:22] schestowitz we can live in biscuits for a wile [20:22] schestowitz while [20:22] schestowitz just a while [20:22] schestowitz and tea [20:22] schestowitz lots of calories in tea with no sugar [20:23] schestowitz sugar canes under water also [20:23] schestowitz no sugar canes in Salisbury :-) [20:23] vZS1_2 lol [20:23] vZS1_2 Plenty of Novichok though [20:32] schestowitz artichoke you say? [20:34] schestowitz Arty choked on Novichok [20:35] -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Canonical/Ubuntu: Kubernetes and Proprietary Software/Spyware From Snaps http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144346 [https://pleroma.site/objects/10312743-129d-4f11-9e7a-9882ea11bde1] [20:36] schestowitz so much of it there that it grows on doorknobs, they say... [20:37] *obarun (~obarun@host-115-126-165-174.fibre.nautile.nc) has joined #techrights [20:45] vZS1_2 The UK is safe [20:45] vZS1_2 Don't you worry [20:48] schestowitz relatively it is [20:48] schestowitz in terms of all sorts of things [20:49] vZS1_2 It's just amusing to see press coverage of things like those incidents [20:49] -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: #Seamonkey Browser Suite updated to 2.53.5 in #PCLinuxOS http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/141761#comment-27137 [https://pleroma.site/objects/f67ddaf4-313c-473c-b54a-e73f30a0ff3a] [20:50] schestowitz I was not even being cynical [20:50] schestowitz in relative terms it's a very safe place [20:50] schestowitz compared with lack of health coverage and gun crime in lang of BoJo's bosses [20:50] schestowitz *land [20:54] -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Endian Community Releases New Version 3.3.2 http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144347 [https://pleroma.site/objects/5745a3a1-782f-44c7-8366-5824b93cf8f2] [20:58] vZS1_2 We've got it better than the US in quite a lot of ways, yeah. [20:59] schestowitz I am trying to see the glass half full here [20:59] schestowitz as we're stuck at home ● Nov 13 [21:00] schestowitz at least we might do some server upgrades, we did ipfs this past week etc. [21:00] schestowitz learning new things [21:00] schestowitz I will do some EPO leaks later tonight, I do a 1-9am shift at work [21:01] schestowitz some people don't even have work or anything to pass time with... [21:01] schestowitz (or income) [21:03] vZS1_2 How is the migration going? [21:04] schestowitz you can see IRC logs [21:04] schestowitz it's done in the public eye for the most part [21:04] schestowitz last night we tried to move the databases to the other datacentres [21:04] schestowitz but the latency was too high [21:04] schestowitz so we'll try db replication next [21:04] schestowitz the databases will move first [21:05] schestowitz the CMS will follow [21:05] schestowitz all 5 of them [21:09] vZS1_2 I'll grep through the logs next time I'm curious. Will log off the desktop now. Cya later. [21:09] *vZS1_2 has quit (Quit: vZS1_2) [21:09] *SubWasted (~quassel@145.168.191.92.dynamic.jazztel.es) has joined #techrights [21:09] *SubWasted has quit (Client Quit) [21:21] -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Devices/Embedded: ESP32 and Raspberry Pi http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144348 [https://pleroma.site/objects/b7d2339a-9172-4778-b1c1-d2c4eac325e8] [21:26] -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Warp: Improved JS performance in Firefox 83 http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144349 [https://pleroma.site/objects/d2b33bdc-058d-44fa-91a7-bf32bb4c029b] [21:32] -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: How Many Users Can Open Source Zoom Alternatives Handle? http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144350 [https://pleroma.site/objects/02f5b87f-6e2a-4474-899a-29bae280a1ca] [21:35] -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Audiocasts/Shows: Xubuntu 20.10, NAS, GNU/Grep/ripgrep http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144351 [https://pleroma.site/objects/900c5ab2-8569-42d0-9791-7d1058618cb4] [21:42] Narrator https://twitter.com/BrideOfLinux/status/1327298934868414464 ... [21:42] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@BrideOfLinux: I'm not upset that Microsoft is involved in Open Source. Good for Microsoft. I am concerned that it's beginning to https://t.co/NSWFgWVunA [21:42] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@BrideOfLinux: I'm not upset that Microsoft is involved in Open Source. Good for Microsoft. I am concerned that it's beginning to https://t.co/NSWFgWVunA [21:42] Narrator it looks bad [21:46] schestowitz see the top comment [21:46] schestowitz gael duval asking me to comment [21:46] schestowitz I will [21:46] schestowitz he founded mandriva [21:46] schestowitz mandrake actually [21:46] schestowitz later mandriva it was coming to be.. [21:46] schestowitz http://techrights.org/2020/11/12/microsoft-playing-double-dutch/ [21:46] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org | Microsoft Playing Hardball and Talking Double Dutch to Undermine the Free Software Community | Techrights [21:48] *inky (~inky@5.77.130.113) has joined #techrights [21:51] -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Mageia 8 is on its way http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144352 [https://pleroma.site/objects/8d5df8c0-eb59-4828-a601-8f70b0adda4f] [21:58] -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Fedora: Changes to Media Writer and New Releases of Fedora 33 ISOs http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144353 [https://pleroma.site/objects/cc359b10-86bc-4192-b608-ca09778577a3] ● Nov 13 [22:01] Narrator i know, i saw it on twitter [22:02] Narrator probably we se something like improved ipy [22:02] Narrator with .net integration with jit [22:06] Narrator ... will see ... [22:10] schestowitz I try now to get drawn into twitter [22:10] DaemonFC[m] I'm glad to see SeaMonkey still around. [22:10] schestowitz it's a shithole [22:10] schestowitz but watch the othr comments in there [22:10] DaemonFC[m] A big old middle finger to modern. [22:10] schestowitz re Rust [22:10] schestowitz and SJVN sings Microsoft's tune [22:10] schestowitz SJVN is corrupted and compromised at this point [22:11] DaemonFC[m] SJVN was heaping praise on Edge spyware for Linux. [22:11] schestowitz Narrator: maybe we'll have a guest post aboyt pypy/i soon [22:11] DaemonFC[m] He's beyond compromised. [22:11] schestowitz not my area [22:11] schestowitz DaemonFC[m]: I heard worse about him [22:11] schestowitz see what he said in the comments above [22:12] schestowitz he also deliberately lied about what I had said about him [22:12] schestowitz to incite people against me [22:12] schestowitz and I fired back [22:12] schestowitz then I quit partricipating in twitter [22:12] schestowitz because it's a shithole of lies like these [22:12] schestowitz mjg59 publicly painted me there as rape apologist [22:13] schestowitz and for merely reposting an article where someone objectively shows discreet debian emails [22:13] mjg59 You then accused me of lying but provided no evidence [22:13] schestowitz about misrepresenting allegations against Appelbaum [22:13] schestowitz and that somehow makes me pro-rape... or something [22:13] mjg59 No, that's not what I said [22:13] schestowitz mjg59: you lied about me [22:13] schestowitz typical BS [22:13] mjg59 I pointed to an article you wrote [22:13] mjg59 Not the Pocock one you reposted [22:13] schestowitz to paint me as some sort of misogynist [22:13] schestowitz and your tweet was liked by Microsofters [22:13] schestowitz stroking their ego, thinking I'm some monster [22:14] schestowitz based on a "tweet" [22:14] schestowitz basically a bunch of total nonsense [22:14] schestowitz this is why twitter is worse than shit [22:14] schestowitz let trump and bannon have it [22:14] schestowitz calling for heads to be "put on a spike" [22:14] mjg59 You just lied about what I said [22:14] schestowitz No, I did not [22:14] mjg59 22:13 < schestowitz> and for merely reposting an article where someone objectively shows discreet debian emails [22:14] schestowitz you misrepresented the article [22:14] schestowitz look what I said [22:14] schestowitz or quote me [22:15] schestowitz don't spin that as something you WANT me to have said [22:15] mjg59 I did not reference the Pocock article [22:15] schestowitz that's what tweets do [22:15] mjg59 I referenced an article you wrote [22:15] schestowitz they're short [22:15] schestowitz so in the guise of brevity people can lie about what they link to [22:15] mjg59 I've corrected you on this multiple times [22:15] schestowitz no [22:15] schestowitz you tried to clear your diaper-filled room [22:15] schestowitz reaslising you cannot just accuse people like this [22:16] schestowitz because it makes you and your mission look incredibly bad [22:16] schestowitz like Sharp did [22:16] schestowitz twisting people's words [22:16] mjg59 http://techrights.org/2020/09/07/the-cost-of-secrecy/ - did you write this article? [22:16] schestowitz to stigmatise people as against majority of humans (women) [22:16] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org | Debian Expulsions and Defamation Were Also Common in the 1990s | Techrights [22:16] mjg59 Because it has your name on it [22:16] schestowitz Yes, quote me from it [22:16] schestowitz don't spin what you THINK I meant [22:17] mjg59 Ok, so which article does https://twitter.com/mjg59/status/1309426144207224832 link to? [22:17] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@mjg59: @schestowitz Continuing to wait honestly how hard is it to justify an assertion [22:17] mjg59 Sorry, https://twitter.com/mjg59/status/1303237879888371712 [22:17] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@mjg59: Just in case you were wondering whether Techrights was at some level devoted to justice, @schestowitz has decided t https://t.co/GPPVX7b6k3 [22:17] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@mjg59: Just in case you were wondering whether Techrights was at some level devoted to justice, @schestowitz has decided t https://t.co/GPPVX7b6k3 [22:17] schestowitz and in such a toxic way that people who don't even click are led to think I'm pro-rape or something [22:17] DaemonFC[m] He seems like a Buffalo Bill to me. [22:17] CrystalMath mjg59, that nick sounds strangely familiar [22:17] CrystalMath is this Matthew Garrett? [22:17] schestowitz friend of the cancel culturists [22:17] schestowitz they pick up targets [22:17] schestowitz then try to cancel them [22:17] mjg59 schestowitz: So, did I link to an article you reposted, or did I link to an article you wrote? [22:17] schestowitz while picking salaries from monopolies [22:18] schestowitz and he's here in IRC to dig dirt [22:18] CrystalMath i mostly remember his outrageous article about how we should make software proprietary instead of free [22:18] schestowitz over a month, found nothing [22:18] DaemonFC[m] Good. Fuck him. [22:19] schestowitz oh, that's rapoe [22:19] schestowitz *rape [22:19] schestowitz watch out [22:19] DaemonFC[m] Lol [22:19] schestowitz Sage and Matt will now say we use the F word [22:19] schestowitz #CancelTechrights (!!!!) [22:19] schestowitz buy google ads [22:19] schestowitz oh, sorry [22:19] schestowitz no need to buy [22:19] schestowitz mjg59 can ask his employer, gratis [22:20] schestowitz #CancelTechrights [22:20] DaemonFC[m] He's probably far too distracted putting Grindr on the hotel touchpad to be a real menace. [22:20] schestowitz like they did Ted T [22:20] schestowitz picking something from like 15 years ago when he brought up rape accusation stats [22:20] schestowitz HOW DARE HE??? [22:21] schestowitz "pervert!!" [22:21] schestowitz Ted had more spine than Greg K-H [22:21] schestowitz who gives the middle finger to the camera [22:21] schestowitz very professional [22:21] schestowitz Ted T still opposed the exFAT agenda in the kernel [22:21] schestowitz to be overruled by Microsoft apologists like Greg K-H [22:22] schestowitz Whose salary was partly supplied by Microsoft for half a decade [22:22] CrystalMath https://mjg59.dreamwidth.org/52907.html?thread=1961643#cmt1961643 [22:22] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-mjg59.dreamwidth.org | mjg59 | Do we need to rethink what free software is? [22:22] CrystalMath this is my comment [22:22] CrystalMath ah, 2019, good old times [22:23] schestowitz He also participated in ousting RMS [22:23] schestowitz who is less rude than him [22:23] CrystalMath i think i was nice in that comment [22:23] schestowitz hours after the media distracted from Gates' MIT scandal [22:23] schestowitz pedophilia first degree connection [22:23] schestowitz he wrote about "post-RMS" [22:23] schestowitz as if RMS was already dead man walking [22:24] schestowitz to start the discussion [22:24] schestowitz then the media left alone the Epstein-Gates scandal [22:24] CrystalMath my opinion stands, that developers of software should not be allowed to dictate how their software is used; if copyright law allows that, then copyright law is evil [22:24] schestowitz RMS lost his 'home' (for 40 year) [22:24] mjg59 schestowitz: Did I link to an article you wrote or to an article you reposted? [22:24] mjg59 This seems like a very simple question [22:24] schestowitz the one I wrote, but you did not quote me, you misrepresented what I said [22:25] schestowitz typical twitter trolling [22:25] schestowitz to cause anger [22:25] schestowitz lynch-mobbing [22:25] schestowitz http://techrights.org/2020/06/08/twitter-cancel-culture/ [22:25] schestowitz like this [22:25] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org | Social Control Media: Where Cancel Culture Thrives | Techrights [22:25] schestowitz you start with a falsehood [22:25] schestowitz people get angry [22:25] CrystalMath schestowitz: well look, i don't believe for a second that you're an actual rape apologist [22:25] DaemonFC[m] Also known as JAQing off. [22:25] schestowitz people "share" (retweet) [22:25] mjg59 schestowitz: So when you said "and for merely reposting an article where someone objectively shows discreet debian emails", was that true? [22:25] schestowitz more people get angry [22:25] schestowitz and nobody even knows the facts, they just get angry [22:25] schestowitz like Sarah Mei posting fake photos [22:26] schestowitz or a fake sign on RMS door [22:26] schestowitz she never removed those defamatory tweets [22:26] schestowitz because her goal wasn't to tell facts [22:26] CrystalMath schestowitz: someone did write that, i think the deception was the idea that RMS wrote that (it's not his handwriting) [22:26] schestowitz it's sabotage [22:27] schestowitz http://techrights.org/2020/09/10/the-fake-door-sign/ [22:27] CrystalMath and it sounds more like a joke poking fun at RMS than anything else [22:27] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org | The Fake Door Sign Used to Frame Richard Stallman and Misrepresent Him One Year Ago (the Media Never Corrected This Slanderous Allegation) | Techrights [22:27] schestowitz apropos SJVN: http://techrights.org/2020/09/10/sjvn-senior-moment/ [22:27] schestowitz facts don't matter now [22:27] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org | One Year Later Steven J. Vaughan-Nichols Libel Against Richard Stallman Remains Online and Uncorrected at ZDNet | Techrights [22:27] schestowitz and the so-called (calling themselves that!) "social control media" "social justice warriors" use Trumpian tweets [22:27] CrystalMath honestly i've heard people tell such jokes about RMS at my university back when i was a student [22:28] schestowitz to rile up their base [22:28] schestowitz based on falsehoods [22:28] schestowitz This one is real http://techrights.org/2020/10/12/tribute-to-the-bill/ [22:28] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org | When Bill Gates Pays a University Through His Friend Epstein (Sex Trafficker) to Call Buildings After Himself | Techrights [22:28] CrystalMath it's not impossible that whoever wrote that on the door sign didn't actually have ill intent [22:29] schestowitz well, then someone took a photograph [22:29] schestowitz and many in twitter used that to lie about RMS [22:29] schestowitz so the damage was done [22:29] schestowitz and if someone has access to MIR, assume age over 18 [22:29] schestowitz so assume extreme immaturity [22:29] mjg59 schestowitz: Was your claim that I was responding to an article you reposted true? [22:30] schestowitz what kind of 18-80 year old writes this shit on a scholar's door? [22:30] schestowitz Is this elementary school? Kindergarten? [22:30] CrystalMath schestowitz: lol, i went to college, i was 18, and lots of people there were super immature [22:30] schestowitz mjg59: my remark links to a reposted article [22:30] schestowitz which you distorted [22:30] schestowitz I meant MIT, not MIR [22:30] schestowitz it's a typo [22:30] mjg59 schestowitz: Was your claim that I was responding to an artcile you reposted true? [22:31] schestowitz my remark links to a reposted article [22:31] schestowitz if I quote someone and then you quote the quoter, whose is it? [22:31] schestowitz or by means of citation [22:31] mjg59 You weren't quoting someone. You were expressing your own opinion of what was written. [22:31] schestowitz either way, you can state in twitter you were wrong to accuse me of that stance [22:32] mjg59 I was responding to what you wrote. [22:32] schestowitz because as your tweet still stands, readers might think I malign rape accusers [22:32] schestowitz which is totally false BTW [22:32] schestowitz seeking moral superiority by twisting and inverting people's views is unfair [22:32] schestowitz RMS called Esptein serial rapist, yet SJVN said he defended Epstein [22:33] schestowitz and that's what ZDNet still says, even in the headline [22:33] schestowitz and some fools still trust ZDNet [22:33] schestowitz later some idiot might cite your tweet [22:33] schestowitz to build a "case" for "nasty techrights" [22:34] schestowitz just don't stick signs on maaa dooor' , mkay? [22:35] schestowitz I knew wikileaks for over a decade [22:35] schestowitz I spoke to assange many times [22:35] schestowitz I know how lynch mobs start [22:35] schestowitz and you're a firestarter, mjg59 [22:35] schestowitz so be aware [22:35] schestowitz we're watching your little schemes [22:35] mjg59 schestowitz: You claimed that Appelbaum was expelled from Tor based on rumours and gossip [22:35] schestowitz you're not here in irc "for the free cake" [22:36] schestowitz yes, he was [22:36] schestowitz but not in those words [22:36] mjg59 No, he was expelled from Tor based on an internal investigation [22:36] schestowitz not gossip [22:36] schestowitz accusations [22:36] schestowitz some unverified [22:36] mjg59 Which deemed that the accusations were credible [22:36] schestowitz and we know debian DAMs misrepresented some accusations [22:36] Ariadne i find it unlikely that mjg59 is trying to sabotage techrights because Google tells him to do so [22:36] schestowitz trumped up charges [22:36] schestowitz didn't say that, either [22:37] schestowitz that's a straw man argument [22:37] schestowitz even before Google paid him salary he did that [22:37] schestowitz and he had loads of employers in recent years [22:37] Ariadne [15:19:38] buy google ads [22:37] Ariadne [15:19:41] oh, sorry [22:37] Ariadne [15:19:44] no need to buy [22:37] Ariadne [15:19:56] mjg59 can ask his employer, gratis [22:37] Ariadne [15:19:59] #CancelTechrights [22:37] Ariadne i mean, you kinda did [22:37] schestowitz he changes employers as often as I change rugs [22:37] schestowitz Ariadne: that's a joke [22:37] mjg59 schestowitz: I've had three employers in the past 8 years [22:37] schestowitz including the hashtag bit [22:38] schestowitz you limit the number of years [22:38] schestowitz extend to 12 years [22:38] schestowitz how many? [22:38] schestowitz 5? 6? [22:38] mjg59 4 [22:38] schestowitz you only count full time [22:38] schestowitz I've worked in the same company 10 years [22:38] Ariadne i don't see why it matters [22:38] mjg59 I was a PhD student before that [22:38] schestowitz so even if it was still 4, that's a lot [22:39] schestowitz average like 2-3 years [22:39] mjg59 It's really not [22:39] schestowitz by whose standards? [22:39] schestowitz people used to work for companies like IBM 30+ years [22:39] mjg59 And they don't any more [22:39] schestowitz but that's not even the point [22:39] schestowitz it's a side issue [22:39] Ariadne 4 years is pretty standard, 5 to 6 years for phd is not even uncommon (a lot of phd candidates have to work a job) [22:39] schestowitz shows employment commitment issues [22:39] CrystalMath personally i think the investigation against Appelbaum was a load of crap [22:40] CrystalMath people in europe seem to universally believe it's american nonsense [22:40] CrystalMath at least, the people i talked to [22:40] schestowitz mjg59: you also mocked Assange based on lies [22:40] CrystalMath he's doing his PhD in germany, and he gave a talk at LEFFEST '19 [22:40] schestowitz mjg59: you think the Sweden case wasn't a farce to distract from exposing war crimes? [22:40] Ariadne knowing some of the people who accused applebaum, i believe their claims to be true [22:40] CrystalMath Ariadne: one person already admitted it was bullcrap [22:40] Ariadne i said 'some' [22:41] Ariadne i did not say i believe all claims to be true [22:41] schestowitz seems to boil down to drugs and sex [22:41] schestowitz and maybe even orgies [22:41] schestowitz which in their own right are not a crime [22:41] schestowitz not that I defend them [22:41] CrystalMath i read something about him sleepwalking and touching people while asleep [22:41] schestowitz but the way this was handled is poor [22:41] Ariadne i do not assert the legitimacy of claims made by people i do not know either way [22:41] schestowitz and shows intolerance to the queer community [22:42] schestowitz we already know about bias against their sexual life/approach [22:42] Ariadne the queer 'hacker' community is complicated [22:42] schestowitz and 'tolerant' project were fact to exploit it [22:42] schestowitz even portraying his fiancee as a victim [22:42] Ariadne i think it was a reasonable intervention [22:42] schestowitz which she strongly objected to [22:42] Ariadne the whole point of that website was to be an intervention [22:43] Ariadne because in 'hacker' circles, being a narc is considered bad [22:43] Ariadne snitches get stitches, etc [22:43] CrystalMath it's ridiculous that you're portraying Appelbaum as some criminal [22:43] schestowitz anyhoo... [22:43] Ariadne i'm not portraying applebaum as anything [22:43] mjg59 CrystalMath: He literally raped people [22:43] schestowitz he was edgy, he worked on exposing things like NSA crimes [22:44] schestowitz which were VASTLY less ethical than things he was accused of [22:44] CrystalMath mjg59: do you have any evidence of that? [22:44] schestowitz and here he is, still canceled [22:44] mjg59 CrystalMath: Yes [22:44] mjg59 I've spoken to multiple people he raped or assaulted [22:44] schestowitz someone who could do further work with wikileaks and Der Speigel [22:44] CrystalMath schestowitz: eh? not in europe, he gave talks last december [22:44] Ariadne i am simply saying that there are incidents involving applebaum where consent was not necessarily granted, which would legally be considered rape [22:44] schestowitz exposing the state [22:44] schestowitz notice how journalism about netsec stopped? [22:44] schestowitz Pompro and Trump threw people in prison for it [22:45] CrystalMath Ariadne: if you're referring to the one where he was asleep, that's complete bullcrap [22:45] Ariadne how do you know? were you there? [22:45] CrystalMath i will definitely die before i believe that nonsense [22:46] CrystalMath i mean, i'm aware that sexsomnia is an actual disorder, but it sounds like an undisprovable accusation - he can't know that he did it because he's asleep [22:46] Ariadne having worked in some of the same spaces as applebaum, i can say that the alleged behavior is in line with what i would have expected [22:46] CrystalMath *he was asleep [22:46] Ariadne but either way, debating this is not really productive for any of us [22:46] CrystalMath sure, i'm just glad that Appelbaum is safe here in europe, away from idiotic americans [22:46] Ariadne software freedom is not advanced by debating whether or not applebaum was "cancelled" [22:47] Ariadne i rather focus on the actual meat and potatoes issues myself [22:47] schestowitz he was degraded, and I think without proper consideration to various factors [22:47] schestowitz including the relationship he had with people [22:47] mjg59 He was degraded because he raped people [22:47] schestowitz some of the allegations boiled down to unwanted approaches [22:47] schestowitz or hitting on women/men [22:47] schestowitz which is no crime [22:47] mjg59 No, but rape is [22:47] schestowitz CoC makes that more of an issues [22:48] schestowitz "unwanted advances" and all [22:48] schestowitz you can get kicked from events you paid for if you ask a woman out [22:48] mjg59 I feel like you're kind of ignoring the "He raped people" thing here [22:48] schestowitz mjg59: you said "raped or assaulted" [22:48] schestowitz from what I read, it's narcotics in the mix [22:48] mjg59 Yes [22:49] Ariadne rape is a crime, and some of the people who had testimonials on that website described privately to me that things happened to them that they did not agree with, which would be considered rape if prosecution were sought [22:49] Ariadne it is what it is [22:49] schestowitz where rape starts to mean things like, two stones people having sex [22:49] schestowitz and then someone getting angry about it [22:49] schestowitz RMS remarked on "assault" [22:49] mjg59 One of the people I've spoken to was merely sexually assaulted by him, not raped [22:49] schestowitz where something like a kiss, unwanted kiss, gets described as "assault" [22:49] schestowitz so we need less generic terms [22:49] Ariadne yes, RMS has shitty views on sex too [22:50] schestowitz he does [22:50] schestowitz but nothing criminal [22:50] schestowitz it's all thoughtcrime [22:50] schestowitz we cancel people based on mere views [22:50] mjg59 schestowitz: Non-consensual touching of someone's sexual organs [22:50] CrystalMath Ariadne: i read the testimonials on that site, it seemed to be split between serious and frivolous accusations [22:50] schestowitz that's "assault" by modern definitions [22:50] CrystalMath Ariadne: and one really kooky conspiracy theory about him secretly working for the NSA [22:50] schestowitz but assault you can see in police videos [22:50] Ariadne CrystalMath: that is actually intentional [22:50] schestowitz where they punch people [22:51] schestowitz I call that groping [22:51] Ariadne CrystalMath: the people who put that site up did not want him to be prosecuted [22:51] schestowitz and it's not legal [22:51] schestowitz albeit nowhere as serious as punching a person in the face [22:51] schestowitz battering [22:51] Ariadne CrystalMath: so you mix in bogus accusations with legitimate ones [22:51] Ariadne CrystalMath: jacobapplebaum.com was intended for an audience of one [22:51] CrystalMath Ariadne: i've never heard of people using lies to tell the truth [22:52] schestowitz that Microsoft-based attack site [22:52] schestowitz lots of anons [22:52] mjg59 schestowitz: You seem to keep focusing on anything other than "he raped people" [22:52] schestowitz that's how lynch mobs thrive [22:52] CrystalMath Ariadne: i mean, that is really crazy, because i based my opinion that Appelbaum is good on the fact that there are lies on that page [22:52] schestowitz innuendo, calling groping "assault or rape" etc. [22:52] schestowitz Than adding quantity [22:52] Ariadne the intention of the people who made that site was not to "cancel" applebaum or have a "lynch mob" [22:52] schestowitz gish gallop [22:52] Ariadne they wanted applebaum to fuck off [22:52] schestowitz And then he cannot properly respond to each in turn [22:52] Ariadne this is how the "hacker" / "infosec" world does shit [22:52] schestowitz the gosh gallop quantity/quality spiel [22:53] schestowitz like the charges against Assange [22:53] Ariadne because they don't want to involve the "feds" [22:53] schestowitz or against Aarson Swartz, esp. the second time around [22:53] CrystalMath Ariadne: yes but don't you see how misleading that can be? [22:53] schestowitz legalese gish gallop [22:53] CrystalMath Ariadne: if i see a bullcrap story on a website i will assume they're all bullcrap [22:53] schestowitz [22:52] schestowitz: You seem to keep focusing on anything other than "he raped people" [22:53] Ariadne again, that is the intention [22:53] schestowitz Ted T wrote about this [22:53] CrystalMath Ariadne: it's how i know someone is telling the truth - they're consistent in telling the truth [22:53] Ariadne the website was meant to be an intervention [22:53] schestowitz and received flak for it [22:54] CrystalMath Ariadne: okay i'm just shocked [22:54] schestowitz I don't want to repeat what Shape attacked him for [22:54] schestowitz but rape can be classified [22:54] Ariadne the people who made that site do not give a flying fuck either way whether anyone on this channel believes the site or not [22:54] schestowitz like I said, having sex between two drunk/stone people can be "rape" in retrospect [22:54] Ariadne that wasn't the point [22:54] schestowitz so the details do matter [22:54] CrystalMath Ariadne: okay i see... but why even make it public, then? [22:54] schestowitz not talking about spiked drinks btw, or date-raping [22:55] Ariadne because radical transparency is part of how that subculture does things [22:55] schestowitz based on leaks [22:55] schestowitz leaked evidence [22:55] schestowitz nsa docs [22:55] schestowitz US cables [22:55] schestowitz not some X told Y that Z got rapes [22:55] Ariadne what they wanted was for applebaum to step back and get his shit together [22:55] schestowitz that's not radical transparency [22:55] schestowitz mjg59 already did that several times [22:55] Ariadne i literally know people involved in that site [22:56] schestowitz said he spoke to anon and anon and anon about person X [22:56] Ariadne and i'm telling you what their motives were [22:56] CrystalMath Ariadne: okay but it definitely sounds like a way to get people to either believe it blindly and hate Appelbaum, or do research, find some nonsense, and then hate the creators of the website [22:56] schestowitz and this isn't transparency [22:56] mjg59 schestowitz: X, Y and Z told Tor that Jake raped them [22:56] schestowitz it's rumour-milling [22:56] Ariadne CrystalMath: yes, and they do not care about that [22:56] schestowitz which is what Zini (Debian Account Manager) did [22:56] DaemonFC[m] He wants us to believe that people are so dumb they'll just listen to him, but then he proves that isn't so by coming here and needlessly trolling to validate himself. [22:56] schestowitz to create a bunch of false sentences and spread these in major publications [22:56] schestowitz like BBC and NYTimes [22:56] mjg59 schestowitz: As a result, he was fired [22:57] DaemonFC[m] He's an incredibly insecure whining little man who is very unpleasant, and I don't know why you don't just get rid of him now. [22:57] CrystalMath DaemonFC[m]: well if schestowitz did that, he'd have to explain why he didn't get of me :P [22:57] CrystalMath *get rid of [22:57] Ariadne personally i find mjg59's insight on many topics valuable [22:57] schestowitz to be clear: 1) I do not defend Appelbaum in general [22:58] schestowitz 2) my view is that some people did not base accusations based on verifiable facts [22:58] DaemonFC[m] It's not bad enough that he feels victimized personally, but he gets off on it to the point where he has to feel offended and victimized on the behalf of others, which is sick. [22:58] CrystalMath Ariadne: do you believe that users deserve freedom 0? [22:58] Ariadne CrystalMath: yes [22:58] schestowitz 3) some deliberately distorted what they had been told (we have HARD evidence of this, a DAM email to the media) [22:58] mjg59 schestowitz: Tor did not fire Jake based on rumours or gossip [22:58] CrystalMath Ariadne: okay then what do you make of mjg59's article that we should make software proprietary and restrict uses [22:58] schestowitz Had a judge taken on the case, at least SOME of the evidence would be thrown out [22:58] schestowitz as misleading or inadmissible [22:58] DaemonFC[m] In fact, I think a psychiatrist would be in order, but then again, that seems to be the case for many of the people RMS allowed to corrode the Free Software Movement (and Foundation). [22:59] schestowitz hearsay is weakest form of evidence [22:59] schestowitz esp. anonymous [22:59] schestowitz see the Scottish case of Alex Salmond [22:59] schestowitz tossed out [22:59] mjg59 schestowitz: Where's the hearsay in this case? [22:59] schestowitz many alleged victims, coordinating among themselves and with media [22:59] schestowitz damage done [22:59] Ariadne schestowitz: as i explained to you several times, Tor did not fire applebaum based on hearsay. their HR person hired an independent investigator to look into the allegations. [22:59] schestowitz acquittal not helping him anymore ● Nov 13 [23:00] schestowitz then they charged people who defended him [23:00] schestowitz Craig Murray for instance/notably [23:00] schestowitz many parallels between those cases [23:00] DaemonFC[m] And regarding the rape fixation, it's interesting that it always comes from people who mainly enjoy sexual congress with themselves. [23:00] Ariadne and the Tor HR investigation was happening *prior* to that website going live [23:00] schestowitz the court reaches the conclusion that it did [23:00] Ariadne applebaum was going to be fired regardless [23:00] Ariadne one of the reasons they put that site up [23:00] Ariadne was because they were concerned about retaliation [23:01] schestowitz [22:59] schestowitz: Where's the hearsay in this case? [23:01] schestowitz Evidence has to meet standards [23:01] schestowitz X told me Y about Z is weak [23:01] schestowitz need to take it up a notch [23:01] mjg59 Yes. That wasn't what happened here. [23:01] Ariadne that's not what happened though [23:01] schestowitz then admit the evidence [23:01] DaemonFC[m] They really don't want Tor to succeed, which makes me wonder if the allegations were part of a government plot to discredit Tor and ruin it. [23:01] Ariadne tor hired an independent firm to investigate [23:01] Ariadne the independent firm found the allegations credible [23:02] DaemonFC[m] Each time they went after someone they unmasked on Tor, it turned out the software worked pretty well and they didn't want to admit that they came up emptyhanded other than tricking people one at a time. [23:02] DaemonFC[m] So they quietly drop charges. [23:02] schestowitz DaemonFC[m]: that would requite evidence >> "V" [23:02] schestowitz "which makes me wonder if the allegations were part of a government plot to discredit Tor and ruin it. " [23:02] schestowitz *require [23:02] DaemonFC[m] They want people to be terrified that it's unsafe to use but they don't want you to know precisely why. [23:02] schestowitz [23:01] tor hired an independent firm to investigate [23:02] schestowitz oh please [23:02] schestowitz like MIT did [23:02] Ariadne they did [23:02] schestowitz they hire the people who suit their outcome [23:02] Ariadne a legit firm [23:02] Ariadne no [23:03] schestowitz otherwise they won't be hired again [23:03] schestowitz MIT did the same [23:03] CrystalMath Ariadne: like a private detective? [23:03] schestowitz after Gates had bribed MIT via Epstein [23:03] Ariadne the firm they hired was a legitimate HR investigation firm [23:03] Ariadne not some fly by night lawyer like trump has [23:03] schestowitz and the findings supported the sponsor of the "independent firm" [23:03] CrystalMath and what did they do? just ask people and take their word for it? [23:03] schestowitz Same re Aaron Swartz [23:03] mjg59 schestowitz: There are literal first person accounts of Jake's behaviour available. That's literally not hearsay. [23:03] schestowitz MIT is hiring 'analysts' and 'consultants' [23:03] schestowitz for the veneer of "not coverup" [23:04] Ariadne mjg59: yes, sworn to the tor lawyers under penalty of perjury [23:04] schestowitz [23:03] the firm they hired was a legitimate HR investigation firm [23:04] schestowitz paid by...? [23:04] Ariadne paid by TOR [23:04] schestowitz aha [23:04] schestowitz exactly [23:04] schestowitz thank you [23:04] Ariadne to provide an impartial investigation [23:04] schestowitz so-called [23:04] Ariadne it would be in TOR's interest to disprove the claims [23:04] schestowitz they are always so impartial [23:04] Ariadne would it not? [23:04] schestowitz that's their biz model [23:04] Ariadne they fired their star coder after all [23:05] schestowitz and when they're impartial the 'wrong way' they go bust [23:05] CrystalMath Ariadne: perhaps they could not disprove the claims, but the claims could still be wrong [23:05] CrystalMath after all, nobody has a time machine to go back in time to see what happened [23:05] CrystalMath if you talk to people, expect to be lied to [23:05] schestowitz Analysts sell out - thats their business model But they are very concerned that they never look like they are selling out, so that makes them very prickly to work with. -Microsoft http://techrights.org/wp-content/uploads/2008/08/comes-3096.pdf [23:05] CrystalMath hence why they should have hired a detective [23:05] schestowitz Same for PIs [23:05] Ariadne CrystalMath: they did [23:05] schestowitz and for those so-called auditors [23:06] Ariadne well, they hired an auditor [23:06] schestowitz they paid for the VENEER of independence [23:06] *zoobab has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) [23:06] Ariadne but that process produced sworn affidavits which were vetted [23:06] CrystalMath Ariadne: someone should have investigated whether the people who made the claims received money from the NSA [23:06] mjg59 CrystalMath: They didn't [23:06] Ariadne applebaum was not just fired because some people on the internet said some stuff [23:06] schestowitz behind the scenes those jokers even laugh at themselves, knowing they're just glorified shills/PR [23:06] schestowitz http://techrights.org/2020/01/10/gates-sponsored-mit/ [23:06] Ariadne tor was looking to *debunk* the claims [23:06] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org | Massachusetts Institute of Tall Tales (MIT) Covers Up Bill Gates Bribery of MIT Through a High-Profile Pedophile, Citing No Evidence Other Than Representatives of Gates Himself | Techrights [23:06] Ariadne because they did not want to fire applebaum [23:06] schestowitz Ariadne: so they said [23:07] schestowitz look who took over afterwards [23:07] Ariadne why would you not take them at their word at that? [23:07] schestowitz I don't want to remark with names in [23:07] Ariadne applebaum was tor's main architect [23:07] mjg59 schestowitz: You're maligning the investigation absed on zero evidence, which seems ironic [23:07] schestowitz Tor has not been the same since, neither was wikileaks [23:07] Ariadne firing him would be a huge loss for the project [23:07] schestowitz and Tor fired loads of devs this year/last year [23:07] CrystalMath Ariadne: maybe these allegations made him a problem for the project [23:07] Ariadne and it has been [23:07] schestowitz [23:07] firing him would be a huge loss for the project [23:07] Ariadne this conversation is giving me a headache, you guys are going in circles chasing fallacies [23:07] schestowitz maybe undermining tor was someone's goal too [23:08] schestowitz not everyone's goal [23:08] schestowitz we had a managed until months ago [23:08] schestowitz they fired her [23:08] schestowitz she bullied some of us [23:08] schestowitz made fake claims about me [23:08] CrystalMath Ariadne: no i'm not 100% sure he's innocent for example, but i'm defending him, idk if that makes me the devil's advocate or just a regular advocate [23:08] schestowitz she destroyed our company [23:08] schestowitz we survived because she was fired [23:08] schestowitz sometimes people who manage orgs undermind them [23:08] schestowitz sometimes partly by inetntion [23:08] Ariadne CrystalMath: you're allowed to have whatever opinion you want regarding the validity of the claims [23:08] schestowitz you know it [23:08] CrystalMath Ariadne: because i don't know if he's guilty, i'm just providing the much needed defense, which would otherwise be silent [23:09] schestowitz and mostly likely you saw such bosses firsthand [23:09] CrystalMath Ariadne: it's bad if everyone's constantly saying the same things [23:09] Ariadne i'm just saying that his firing is not as schestowitz characterizes [23:09] schestowitz so I'm not easily buying the idea Tor FOUGHT to KEEP Jake Appelbaum [23:09] CrystalMath Ariadne: someone needs to say the contrary, or we will never achieve understanding [23:09] Ariadne why would they not fight to keep applebaum? [23:09] schestowitz some did, maybe higher up there were demands to shame the project and remove him [23:09] Ariadne applebaum was a key person in tor [23:09] CrystalMath Ariadne: right and that's not a bad argument, although what if they were afraid that people would avoid tor because of allegations even if they are false?> [23:09] Ariadne please explain this theory [23:10] schestowitz [23:09] applebaum was a key person in tor [23:10] schestowitz maybe some people near/inside tor want the project to 1) fail [23:10] schestowitz 2) change [23:10] Ariadne if they wanted to fire applebaum [23:10] schestowitz 3) want the power vacuum [23:10] Ariadne they would have just fired him [23:10] Ariadne they wouldn't have hired an outside firm to investigate [23:10] schestowitz they can advantage their own career in his absence [23:10] Ariadne you only do that when you're looking to keep someone [23:10] schestowitz sometimes companies fire their best people [23:10] mjg59 schestowitz: You can assert that the accusations made against Jake were not credible if you want to, but that doesn't change the fact that he was fired in response to first person accusations [23:11] schestowitz because they're perceived as threat to the management [23:11] schestowitz either replacing those managers or something else [23:11] CrystalMath Ariadne: but consider this possibility... your lead developer has been accused of some things, there's no way to prove one way or the other, but if you keep him your PR goes down, what do you do? [23:11] mjg59 schestowitz: If I claim that something happened to me, that's not a rumour. It's not gossip. [23:11] Ariadne mjg59: first person accusations that were vetted by lawyers, even [23:11] schestowitz [23:11] schestowitz: If I claim that something happened to me, that's not a rumour. It's not gossip. [23:11] schestowitz I know no names [23:11] schestowitz I know Agora something [23:11] schestowitz pseudonyms [23:12] schestowitz and I don't know the nature of that particular case [23:12] Ariadne CrystalMath: if you're tor, you say it is an intellgence community hoax [23:12] schestowitz it needs to be handled one at a time [23:12] schestowitz it's a gish gallop and disorientates [23:12] Ariadne and then it blows over in a week [23:12] CrystalMath Ariadne: would that really be smart? randomly blame someone else? [23:12] CrystalMath *that would [23:12] Ariadne yes, absolutely [23:12] mjg59 schestowitz: Why does you knowing or not knowing names affect whether or not something was a rumour? [23:13] mjg59 It influences whether you, personally, find the accusations credible [23:13] mjg59 But it doesn't change their nature [23:13] mjg59 Several people made direct accusations against Jake [23:13] mjg59 Maybe you don't believe them! [23:13] schestowitz fear of retaliation seems weak in this case [23:14] schestowitz as we know the full names of both Assange's accusers [23:14] Ariadne uhh [23:14] mjg59 But that doesn't make those accusations a "rumour" or "gossip" [23:14] schestowitz whose 'case' was pretty much rejected [23:14] Ariadne fear of retaliation with jake is not weak [23:14] schestowitz but not before years of dragging Assange through media mud [23:14] schestowitz Trump had many women publicly reveal themselves [23:14] Ariadne applebaum used to ddos people for arguing with him on rc [23:14] Ariadne irc* [23:14] schestowitz and his base is FFFAAAAAR scarier than anything tor -related [23:15] CrystalMath Ariadne: idk, it sounds a little too simple to me... so they would pay for an investigation to see if Appelbaum is guilty, but they would just JUMP to the conclusion that the NSA did it? [23:15] Ariadne CrystalMath: that's not what i am saying [23:15] schestowitz [23:14] applebaum used to ddos people for arguing with him on rc [23:15] schestowitz never heard that before [23:15] schestowitz interesting if true [23:15] schestowitz and not some winnuke.exe when he was a teen [23:15] Ariadne his entire MO was to intimidate other infosec people [23:15] schestowitz we all did that as teens, to one another [23:15] Ariadne to get what he wanted [23:15] schestowitz thought it was funny [23:16] schestowitz you can get ip over irc [23:16] CrystalMath Ariadne: there was a story like that on "the website", but the guy who wrote it admitted he lied [23:16] schestowitz ddos is intimidation? [23:16] Ariadne yes, that's why i IRC from my colo [23:16] CrystalMath and removed the story [23:16] schestowitz I'd say ddos is being an arse if they know he's the one doing it [23:16] schestowitz ddos would not dry their cpu [23:16] schestowitz *fry [23:17] Ariadne CrystalMath: there's plenty of people who will gladly say jacob ddosed them [23:17] schestowitz their pc? [23:17] Ariadne like spend 5 minutes on infosec twitter [23:17] Ariadne schestowitz: like their internet connection, to make it inoperable [23:18] CrystalMath was he a teen when he did this? [23:18] schestowitz there's no "infosec twitter", but there are tweets [23:18] schestowitz some of the tweets are even sponsored fakes [23:18] schestowitz to portray purveyors of back doors as defenders of security [23:18] CrystalMath *when he allegedly did this [23:18] Ariadne he has done it as an adult lmfao [23:18] CrystalMath idk that sounds pretty immature [23:18] schestowitz I was win-nuked a lot [23:18] Ariadne schestowitz: when i say "infosec twitter" i mean "the large group of twitter users who are infosec people" [23:18] schestowitz when I was 'adult' at 15 or so [23:18] schestowitz windows 95 days [23:19] schestowitz and I had to reboot [23:19] schestowitz that makes me a victim of attacks, I suppose. My mates in my IM lists nuked me... for shits and giggles [23:19] schestowitz Ariadne: many are posers [23:19] schestowitz many also anonymous [23:19] Ariadne yeah no, i am talkng volumetric udp floods [23:19] schestowitz and many with sponsored "tweets" [23:20] schestowitz without disclosure [23:20] Ariadne not some winnuke crap [23:20] schestowitz how long ago was that? [23:20] schestowitz iirc, he's younger than me [23:20] Ariadne like 2014, 2015 [23:20] schestowitz udp is barely used much anymore [23:20] schestowitz never saw even claims of it, but I may take your word for it [23:21] CrystalMath was there anyone in 2014 who had a public IP address? [23:21] Ariadne i assure you udp flooding is alive and well [23:21] schestowitz udp floods [23:21] schestowitz I saw worse [23:21] CrystalMath i mean that was the time where CGNAT was a thing [23:21] CrystalMath but IPv6 not really [23:21] schestowitz the people exposed by wikileaks took the whole of SYRIA offline! [23:21] schestowitz bricking theitr routers [23:21] CrystalMath i couldn't tell you my public IP even if i wanted to, since it's not really mine, it's my ISP's exit node, i'm in a CGNAT [23:21] CrystalMath it was the same in 2014 [23:21] schestowitz wikileaks also exposed aggressive violent rapes [23:22] schestowitz by US soldiers [23:22] schestowitz but let's focus on Assange having a "morning second round" with no condom [23:22] Ariadne cool [23:22] mjg59 Strong whataboutism energy [23:22] Ariadne schestowitz: assange said he was using a condom and did not, that is a crime in sweden [23:22] schestowitz you also took on Assange [23:22] schestowitz you should thank assANGE [23:23] schestowitz as a self-described "justice warriors" [23:23] Ariadne schestowitz: because the consent was predicated on condom usage [23:23] schestowitz he exposed the worst kinds of criminals [23:23] CrystalMath Assange is a hero [23:23] Ariadne yes [23:23] schestowitz people who behead and put on cranes homosexuals [23:23] schestowitz yet here we are [23:23] schestowitz talking to a canceled of Assange [23:23] Ariadne it is possible to do a lot of good things and also do a fucked up things too [23:23] Ariadne it is the human condition [23:23] schestowitz who travels to Knightsbridge to mock Assange with a sign outside the embassy [23:23] CrystalMath okay, so you have accepted that everyone is bad? [23:24] DaemonFC[m] The landlord asked why I preferred to use the post office money orders. [23:24] Ariadne i have accepted that people can and do make mistakes [23:24] CrystalMath then we can only look at the good - bad difference [23:24] Ariadne and unfortunately, sometimes those mistakes are crimes [23:24] CrystalMath i heard Assange misgender Chelsea Manning [23:24] CrystalMath it was disappointing to hear [23:24] CrystalMath but he's still a hero [23:24] schestowitz a lot of the world is relativism [23:24] schestowitz so you focus on the lesser offense [23:24] schestowitz to malign the accuser [23:24] mjg59 schestowitz: Simple question - was Jake fired by Tor because of rumours and gossip? [23:24] schestowitz or whistleblower [23:25] CrystalMath Ariadne: honestly, we should not be so big on punishing people left and right [23:25] schestowitz Assange "conspired" [23:25] DaemonFC[m] I told him it gives the post office some money, which sticks Trump in the eye, my bank charges so much for checks that it's not worth it, and that if anyone commits fraud, it's the Postal Inspection Service that investigates. [23:25] Ariadne i think rape is not a 'lesser' offense [23:25] schestowitz espionage act [23:25] schestowitz Daniel Pocock is "trolling" [23:25] Ariadne CrystalMath: we should not, HINCE why they made that website as an intervention attempt [23:25] DaemonFC[m] Those Postal Inspection police do not fuck around. Steve Bannon and Brian Kolfage found that out. [23:25] CrystalMath Ariadne: i don't think that was equal to a rape where someone grabs someone and forces sexual activity [23:25] schestowitz just ignored $300,000 cheques from Google [23:25] CrystalMath Ariadne: i'm still talking about Assange [23:25] schestowitz and initimation of GSOC/Outreachy interns [23:25] DaemonFC[m] Assange will get what's coming to him. [23:25] Ariadne CrystalMath: sweden defines rape as any non-consenting sex act [23:26] schestowitz because Pocock is "a troll" [23:26] schestowitz 20 years doing SIP [23:26] schestowitz suddenly a "troll" [23:26] CrystalMath Ariadne: still, it's not always the same, even if it's all rape [23:26] schestowitz 20 years of "good cover" [23:26] schestowitz for a "troll" [23:26] Ariadne CrystalMath: its still fucked up regardless [23:26] DaemonFC[m] Honestly, he should have probably double timed it to get to Russia or something, like Snowden did. [23:26] Ariadne if you tell your partner you're using a condom and then you don't [23:26] CrystalMath Ariadne: but again, not the same, there's both worse and better things [23:26] Ariadne that is fucked up [23:27] Ariadne and in sweden, that is a criminal offense [23:27] schestowitz DaemonFC[m]: you're just angry because fo 2016 [23:27] schestowitz focus on all the other leaks [23:27] schestowitz he helped you [23:27] schestowitz vault7 2017 [23:27] schestowitz march 7th iirc [23:27] Ariadne idk if vault7 actually helped us [23:27] schestowitz more proof that a lot of privacy stuff is snakeoil and oure junk [23:27] DaemonFC[m] Trump alone is unforgivable. [23:27] CrystalMath Ariadne: again, i don't believe that mild crime should be punished the same as a serious crime [23:27] schestowitz *pire [23:27] Ariadne there's a lot of script kiddies who took that malware and made ransomware out of t [23:27] schestowitz *pure even [23:28] CrystalMath Ariadne: it's not justice [23:28] schestowitz [23:27] idk if vault7 actually helped us [23:28] DaemonFC[m] The damage that asshole did is never going to be fixed. [23:28] schestowitz oh, right, let's defend back doors [23:28] CrystalMath Ariadne: it's in fact incredibly unjust [23:28] schestowitz maybe it helped the US [23:28] schestowitz at the imperialist level/sense [23:28] CrystalMath Ariadne: punishing Assange the same as an actual rapist would be incredibly unjust, and i hope it doesn't happen for that reason [23:28] DaemonFC[m] We already knew that the government created backdoors and weaponized vulnerabilities beyond what Microsoft and Apple put in for them. [23:28] Ariadne schestowitz: i'm not defending backdoors, but software vulnerabilties are not "back doors" [23:28] CrystalMath Ariadne: now, did he do *something*, maybe [23:28] schestowitz nice to be able to commit espionage and extort people in OTHER nations [23:28] schestowitz power aphrodisiacs [23:29] schestowitz [23:28] schestowitz: i'm not defending backdoors, but software vulnerabilties are not "back doors" [23:29] Ariadne CrystalMath: the swedes gave up on prosecution anyway [23:29] schestowitz bug doors [23:29] CrystalMath Ariadne: i'm not sure that that's not just a trick to get back at him for revealing all the crimes of the states of the world [23:29] schestowitz and weaponised, with complicity from vendors at times [23:29] mjg59 schestowitz: You seem to be wandering quite far off the point here [23:29] CrystalMath Ariadne: really, we should be looking at governments with far more mistrust and disdain than we are [23:29] CrystalMath Ariadne: ALL governments [23:30] Ariadne sure [23:30] schestowitz we can all agree there's motivation to "put their heads on stakes" (to use the words of Trumbannon) [23:30] CrystalMath Ariadne: i mean they are the worst criminals, so who are they to say Assange did anything wrong? [23:30] schestowitz and so the selective enforcement in the under-the-belt department does raise questions [23:30] Ariadne CrystalMath: i do not care about the criminal prosecution, i care about the woman who assange bullshitted about condom usage [23:30] schestowitz notice how they did the same to Daniel Ellsberg [23:31] CrystalMath Ariadne: how is Sweden so morally high, when they are members of NATO, and themselves guilty of countless rapes and murders in Iraq? [23:31] Ariadne it's a simple question [23:31] schestowitz Ariadne: let's arrest a man for that, to spite what wikileaks exposed [23:31] Ariadne do you think it is fucked up that assange told his date that he used a condom when he did not? [23:31] schestowitz she later boasted abnout him [23:32] schestowitz she also said she was "choked" [sic] (shocked) about the charges [23:32] schestowitz and before that she said she really wanted him [23:32] schestowitz didn't bother her until a Swedish tabloid offered her lots of cash [23:32] schestowitz (now she's a he apparently) [23:32] Ariadne sure, we can agree that there was likely chicanery involved here [23:32] mjg59 Continuing not to answer the question [23:33] schestowitz (so it's inevitable someone might pull a CoC and said I said something wrong in the pronoun sense) [23:33] Ariadne but yes, anyway [23:33] CrystalMath the question was about Appelbaum i think? [23:33] Ariadne do you think it is fucked up that assange told his date that he used a condom when he did not? [23:33] CrystalMath Ariadne: yes [23:33] Ariadne ok, good [23:34] *schestowitz doesn't think she minded being impregnated, considering her SMS messages [23:34] schestowitz (worried about STDs) [23:34] schestowitz and him being tested and all [23:34] CrystalMath schestowitz: well... i don't know if this person said anything about that, and you don't know if this person had some form of birth control [23:34] Ariadne it is possible to oppose criminal prosecution while at the same time not agreeing with the prosecuted action [23:34] schestowitz BTW, condoms don't guarantee protection from STDs, far from it [23:35] CrystalMath Ariadne: of course, but my point that not all bad things are equal; it's far worse to be a serial killer who raped and killed 100 people [23:35] Ariadne anyway, schestowitz hasn't answered either question [23:35] CrystalMath *is that [23:35] schestowitz the whole diversion of the discussion from war crimes to latex is part of the intention [23:35] Ariadne CrystalMath: sure [23:35] schestowitz we're talking about a mm-thin piece of latex [23:35] schestowitz not millions of dead people [23:35] schestowitz and leaks that show criminal intent [23:36] CrystalMath Ariadne: therefore the US army in iraq is a far worse criminal than Assange could even have the theoretical capability of being [23:36] Ariadne sure, but that is irrelevant here [23:36] schestowitz Swedish standards in that regard aren't even applicable in many countries [23:36] schestowitz (not saying it's just or unjust) [23:36] schestowitz Ariadne: it is relevant [23:37] Ariadne no, it is offtopc [23:37] mjg59 Ok, I'm just going to note that Dr Schestowitz refuses to say that it's fucked up to tell your partner that you're wearing a condom when you're not [23:37] Ariadne offtopic* [23:37] schestowitz Ariadne: take pocock for instance [23:37] schestowitz some people wrongly accuse him of some serious crimes [23:37] schestowitz based on fabrications and distortions [23:37] schestowitz that's to distract from the real scandal [23:37] schestowitz and he's rightly upset about that being done [23:38] Ariadne so cover the real scandal? [23:38] schestowitz both by debian and fsfe [23:38] schestowitz they're red-faced [23:38] schestowitz they looked for revenge on him [23:38] schestowitz which they partly got, undermining his career [23:38] Ariadne some advice -- when you waste your time defending bullshit, you get neck deep in bullshit [23:38] schestowitz no [23:38] schestowitz when you expose power [23:38] schestowitz you have BS come your way [23:38] schestowitz story for you, Ariadne [23:38] Ariadne yes, and if you stick on topic, they will come for you directly [23:38] schestowitz I started proper advocacy around 2003 [23:38] schestowitz within years I had reeeealy nasty attacks on me [23:38] Ariadne whch means their resources are now split [23:39] schestowitz people posting in my name [23:39] schestowitz saying I had cut off my bits [23:39] schestowitz painting me as nazi etc. [23:39] schestowitz really, really horrible things [23:39] schestowitz to provoke me [23:39] schestowitz and all I did was name facts [23:39] schestowitz for that alone [23:39] schestowitz you think you get no pushback? [23:39] schestowitz Try it [23:39] schestowitz when you become effective they throw aNYTHING at you [23:40] schestowitz and then you waste time, like in this case, having to confront career "trolls" like mjg59 [23:40] mjg59 Like the fact that you refuse to say that lying about whether you're wearing a condom is bad [23:40] schestowitz supposedly friend of FS [23:40] schestowitz got an award [23:40] schestowitz from the people who may have also wanted RMS removed [23:40] schestowitz and now he publcily wants to portray me as "rape" something [23:41] schestowitz never got close to any sexual misappropriaties [23:41] schestowitz I didn't even have many girlfriends [23:41] schestowitz but then comes some total idiot like mjg59 [23:41] schestowitz throwing shittweets [23:41] schestowitz shitposting things [23:41] schestowitz to soil the name of a site [23:41] schestowitz not accusing it of being wrong [23:41] schestowitz or lying [23:41] schestowitz or inaccurate [23:42] schestowitz but painting that site as some sort of pro-rape thing [23:42] schestowitz this is what they did to wikileaks [23:42] schestowitz I wasn't born yesterday [23:42] schestowitz I saw things [23:42] schestowitz I even told my wife, many times, wait until they fabricate something [23:42] mjg59 This would be amazing set to the Downfall video [23:42] schestowitz something to do with 'Sex" [23:42] schestowitz mjg59 was the moment I said, you gotta look at this!! [23:42] schestowitz mjg59 first [23:42] schestowitz then another person [23:42] schestowitz and they build up the stigma [23:43] schestowitz that's twitter [23:43] schestowitz and it's boiling down to what? [23:43] Ariadne you realize i spent 3 years documenting security vulnerabilities in Mastodon, right? [23:43] schestowitz Zini lying about something someone emailed him [23:43] Ariadne people on Mastodon SWATed me and called me a nazi and shit as a result [23:43] CrystalMath i don't think schestowitz actually did anything wrong really, he's right that we shouldn't be focusing on the bad side of people who did incredibly good things; that doesn't mean to not even question the things they do, but still, to acknowledge the good they did [23:43] Ariadne but, surprisingly, i came out of it unscathed because it was all BS [23:43] schestowitz to make Appelbaum look like more than a monster than he might have been (I think he's a pervert, but it's stil, wrong to trump things up) [23:44] mjg59 schestowitz: Was Jake fired by Tor because of rumours and gossip? [23:44] schestowitz Ariadne: they did [23:44] schestowitz good [23:44] schestowitz so you understand me [23:44] schestowitz and can relate [23:44] mjg59 schestowitz: Was Jake expelled from Debian because of rumours and gossip? [23:44] schestowitz hope you 'stood your ground' (metaphor) and responded [23:44] CrystalMath i didn't even know he was expelled from debian at all [23:44] schestowitz (not to trolls) [23:44] Ariadne (i left Pleroma because i did not wish to work with TERFs) [23:44] CrystalMath i didn't even know he was in the debian project [23:44] mjg59 Answer: No, it was on the basis of first hand accounts [23:44] schestowitz Ariadne: I once looked up your name [23:44] schestowitz ended up in imposter site [23:45] schestowitz painting you as a terror sympathiser, using your own name [23:45] Ariadne that is because i defended a freenode staffer's reputation [23:45] schestowitz so you know the way these things go [23:45] Ariadne yes, but i will willingly say it is fucked up to lie about condom use [23:45] schestowitz [23:44] schestowitz: Was Jake fired by Tor because of rumours and gossip? [23:45] *zoobab (zoobab@5.226.149.169) has joined #techrights [23:45] schestowitz Not the point I was addressing [23:45] schestowitz I cited the article by Pocock [23:46] CrystalMath okay i don't believe for one second that Ariadne is a terror sympathizer [23:46] schestowitz it was a viral article showing hard proof about one particular allegation [23:46] schestowitz and it was raw and clear... Zini had lied [23:46] schestowitz Enrico didn't do this by mistake [23:46] mjg59 schestowitz: You wrote "Something similar happened to Jacob Appelbaum" [23:46] schestowitz he had motivations [23:46] schestowitz and it worked [23:47] Ariadne what mjg59 is saying is that you brought applebaum into it when you didn't need to do so [23:47] Ariadne and so he finds that suspect [23:47] schestowitz [23:45] yes, but i will willingly say it is fucked up to lie about condom use [23:47] schestowitz iirc, he joked [23:47] schestowitz "I'm wearing you" [23:47] schestowitz in response to question like, "are you wearing a condom" [23:47] schestowitz in Sweden they called it "sex by surprise" [23:48] Ariadne christfuck [23:48] schestowitz not sure of the swedish word, they have one-word things for flightshame and stuff... like german [23:48] schestowitz but the condom thing was an alternative narrative [23:48] schestowitz as if, she was ok with 'morning sex' (pardon the nsfw lansuage) [23:48] schestowitz but the condom wearing was the accusation [23:48] Ariadne is it fucked up to lie about condom use or not [23:48] schestowitz which made her "choked" [sic] later [23:49] schestowitz because she didn't think it would lead to police charges [23:49] schestowitz she likes Julian [23:49] schestowitz before and after [23:49] schestowitz *liked [23:49] CrystalMath i think they're asking for your opinion on the hypothetical idea of lying about wearing a condom [23:49] Ariadne this is like when trump was asked to denounce the proud boys [23:49] schestowitz there's evidence of it [23:49] schestowitz photographs and SMS [23:49] Ariadne you're trying to justify something i didn't ask about [23:49] CrystalMath i'm pretty sure this is just a misunderstanding [23:49] schestowitz here we are having 'latex talk' [23:49] schestowitz she didn't contract STD [23:50] schestowitz or get pregnant [23:50] Ariadne that's still not the question i asked [23:50] schestowitz and meanwhile we have a world where 10k die per day from covid [23:50] schestowitz and there's a serial rapist (trump) playing golf to the tune of it [23:50] schestowitz while blackmailing chinese companies for microsoft to cheapen them and steal [23:50] CrystalMath i... think they're just asking for your opinion on the hypothetical idea of lying about wearing a condom [23:50] Ariadne ^ [23:51] schestowitz CrystalMath: right [23:51] schestowitz well, I answered before [23:51] Ariadne where? [23:51] schestowitz in many countries it would not be a crime [23:51] schestowitz if consensual sex [23:51] Ariadne that's not what i asked [23:51] schestowitz Ariadne: most countries [23:51] Ariadne i asked if you think it is fucked up to lie about condom use or not [23:52] Ariadne i did not ask if iit was legal or not [23:52] schestowitz in case you didn't notice, in many countries you can even kill people for having the 'wrong' kind of sex [23:52] schestowitz or for wanting it [23:52] schestowitz thoughtcrime [23:52] schestowitz in terms of sex, in some countries men marry kids [23:52] Ariadne i live in a country where it is legal for someone to kill me and claim they were scared of me because i'm transgender [23:52] schestowitz and it's fucked up [23:52] CrystalMath i believe the question was about your opinion on its morality, notwithstanding the relativity of morality across cultures [23:52] Ariadne but yes, what CrystalMath said [23:53] schestowitz if you consider her attitude towards him, they were in a relationship [23:53] Ariadne you're still contextualizing [23:53] schestowitz and some policemen would be inattentive towards claims of unwanted sex from husband [23:53] schestowitz unless violence was involved [23:53] schestowitz not 'emotional violence' [23:53] schestowitz but actual physical violence [23:54] mjg59 Ok let's try this the other way [23:54] schestowitz in her case, with the condom, it's problematic cause they were more or less in a relationship [23:54] mjg59 schestowitz: Is it perfectly reasonable to lie about whether or not you're wearing a condom [23:54] schestowitz so he police might say "balance or probabilities" [23:55] schestowitz and "we have more urgent issues to deal with down in those cities where 'gangs' burn up cars and hurl grenades into homes" [23:55] schestowitz mjg59: no [23:55] schestowitz but whether to prosecute for it or not if a case needing inquiry [23:55] schestowitz same for littering, a lesser crime [23:56] schestowitz even if you litter 10 times in a row [23:56] mjg59 schestowitz: So it it fucked up to lie about whether you're wearing a condom? [23:56] CrystalMath Ariadne: is that the ridiculously named panic defense? [23:56] schestowitz because the victim of the crime is not the same as "some" [23:56] Ariadne CrystalMath: yes [23:56] schestowitz in this case, a couple in a relationship [23:56] schestowitz fee-dodging in a train likewise [23:56] Ariadne needless to say, that is one of many reasons i am looking forward to being in NL as soon as possible :) [23:56] schestowitz or kids sending nudes to each other [23:56] schestowitz "unwanted nudes" [23:57] schestowitz yes,criminalise kids, that'll help [23:57] CrystalMath schestowitz: doesn't britain do that specifically? [23:57] schestowitz "What are you in for? [23:57] schestowitz " [23:57] schestowitz put them in prison, that's where they might ACTUALLY get rapes [23:57] schestowitz *raped [23:57] schestowitz by other inmates or wards [23:58] Ariadne the odds of prison rape are actually astronomically low [23:58] schestowitz CrystalMath: not sure, not following those things [23:58] schestowitz they mean nothing to me, never took any sexualised pictures, was never dumb enough to do that ever [23:58] schestowitz (apparently many do or did that) [23:59] CrystalMath schestowitz: i know because RMS mentioned that people under 16 can be arrested for having nudes of themselves in the UK, which is ridiculous [23:59] schestowitz Ariadne: but the damage of even one incident is vast... can leak to suicide [23:59] Ariadne anyway, needless to say schestowitz and i have a lot of disagreements on various topics [23:59] mjg59 schestowitz: If you're trying to argue that the carceral state is a bad thing then I'm not going to disagree [23:59] Ariadne main reason i manage his servers is because he pisses off the EPO which is pretty great [23:59] schestowitz all people do [23:59] Ariadne (: [23:59] schestowitz all people disagree on some things [23:59] schestowitz mjg59: Turning is a good example [23:59] schestowitz prison or suicide gemini://gemini.techrights.org/tr_text_version/irc-log-techrights-131120.txt

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